pcnd5584 Posted September 9, 2006 Share Posted September 9, 2006 It certainly does seem strange, when you consider the number of Baroque "trumpet voluntaries", that more composers have not written Tuba Tunes. Lang and Cocker are the only two I can think of. Perhaps it suggests that organists have always known that the stop is more effective the less it is used. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> VH - this is music to my ears! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest paul@trinitymusic.karoo.co.uk Posted September 9, 2006 Share Posted September 9, 2006 It certainly does seem strange, when you consider the number of Baroque "trumpet voluntaries", that more composers have not written Tuba Tunes. Lang and Cocker are the only two I can think of. Perhaps it suggests that organists have always known that the stop is more effective the less it is used. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> There are others. There's an excellent one by Reginald Porter Brown - a crowd pleaser! one by Frederick Candlyn (Tuba Theme) very noble and interesting and one by Eric Thiman, fair but not particuarly striking. What would the Whitlock Sonata be like without a Tuba? - actually, I know: The Organ Club got treated to a performance at Gloucester Cathedral about five years ago and when we got to the bit that ought to have been a Tuba, we got Great Reeds and Cornet transferred to manual IV - it was quite ghastly! Several Bairstow works (uniformly excellent) all require Tuba. Stanford, especially Marcia Eroica - very fine Parry, of course 'The' Healey Willan etc. etc. The Tuba is part of our heritage. Bad enough losing our Swell Oboes and 16' Bourdons, now they're trying to take away our lovely Tubas... for shame!! Actually, there's one use for a Tuba that has been missed so far.... they are wonderful for OTT last verse accompaniments at Civic Services. Pity pcnd doesn't like the idea of a single stop shining out over the rest of the organ, even his beloved Chamade might be useful for such a purpose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pierre Lauwers Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 Yes, there are some threatened Species; next to the Tuba, there are some others stops that are "bad, wrong..." In continental Europe this mind is nearly gone. At Temple du Salin, Toulouse, the builder Daldosso even made a Voix angélique. Free reeds are already next door, Harmonia aethereas are built again, a Tuba was attempted ar Dudelange. Don't melt them, at least store them properly! Thanks! Pierre Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcnd5584 Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 What would the Whitlock Sonata be like without a Tuba? - actually, I know: The Organ Club got treated to a performance at Gloucester Cathedral about five years ago and when we got to the bit that ought to have been a Tuba, we got Great Reeds and Cornet transferred to manual IV - it was quite ghastly! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> OK - but if you had never heard the Whitlock before that day (and were not expecting a Tuba at any point), would the music still have been effective? The Tuba is part of our heritage. Bad enough losing our Swell Oboes and 16' Bourdons, now they're trying to take away our lovely Tubas... for shame!! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I agree - I would not wish to remove them, as I mentioned previously; I just would not wish to use them. I certainly think that the loss of Swell Oboes and Pedal Bourdons is lamentable. Actually, there's one use for a Tuba that has been missed so far.... they are wonderful for OTT last verse accompaniments at Civic Services. Pity pcnd doesn't like the idea of a single stop shining out over the rest of the organ, even his beloved Chamade might be useful for such a purpose. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I do use my chamade for this - but with two choruses and the Swell reeds coupled (not because it cannot cope, but because I prefer the sound this way). In fact, whilst I cannot see a great deal of use for a stop which can obliterate the rest of the instrument put together, I do like a good chamade. It is the timbre of the stop (tuba) which I dislike, as opposed to what it is used for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pierre Lauwers Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 There are no spanish organs with a chamade Trumpet that has not, on the same Manual, a Trompeta real, which is on the chest, so "interior". They are always drawn togheter, that is, either the Trompeta real alone, or both. The chamade is then always the "second" Trumpet. "Néo-classiques" builders often forgot the first, building chamade stops even in small rooms. A typical néo-classique idea; the stop then becomes something else than its model. Chamades are now as numerous as Fish & Chips, while Tubas are very seldom. (on a worldwide basis). I give here again a link to a file of Mr Gerhard Grenzing about the extraordinary spanish organ-builder Jordi Bosch. It is interesting to see how he specified and built his chamade stops, and -above all- how special were the chests on which he placed them: http://www.grenzing.com/pdf/Jordi_Bosch_ISO.pdf Pierre Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Coram Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 Chamades are now as numerous as Fish & Chips, while Tubas are very seldom.(on a worldwide basis). <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Shurely shome mishtake? I know of only five chamades in the UK, and I'm not sure that this figure shouldn't actually be 3; there are at least four tubas within 10 miles of my home and 16 within 25 miles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcnd5584 Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 Chamades are now as numerous as Fish & Chips, while Tubas are very seldom.(on a worldwide basis). Pierre <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Well, just as long as you have tomato ketchup on them, Pierre - I am not sure about all that mayonnaise stuff.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vox Humana Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 Oh I dunno. I can just imagine buying a Tuba and mayo roll at our local caff. Very filling... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcnd5584 Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 Shurely shome mishtake? I know of only five chamades in the UK, and I'm not sure that this figure shouldn't actually be 3; there are at least four tubas within 10 miles of my home and 16 within 25 miles. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Well, there are a few more than that: St. John's, Cambridge Liverpool Metropolitan Cathedral Wimborne Minster Cirencester Parish Church Ulster Hall, Belfast Bute Hall, University of Glasgow Dunster Parish Church Romsey Abbey (the Tuba is technically a chamade, even if not actually on display) Ellesmere College Radley School Chapel Lancing College Chapel The Old Independent Church, Haverhill Brecon Cathedral Abergavenny Parish Church (or somewhere near there; this church is shortly to have a new instrument, built by William Drake, of Buckfastleigh). Arundel Cathedral (re-instated at the time of the recent restoration) Royal Naval Chapel, Greenwich (retained in the David Wells rebuild, but placed behind the front pipes) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJJ Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 Well, there are a few more than that: St. John's, Cambridge Liverpool Metropolitan Cathedral Wimborne Minster Cirencester Parish Church Ulster Hall, Belfast Bute Hall, University of Glasgow Dunster Parish Church Romsey Abbey (the Tuba is technically a chamade, even if not actually on display) Ellesmere College Radley School Chapel Lancing College Chapel The Old Independent Church, Haverhill Brecon Cathedral Abergavenny Parish Church (or somewhere near there; this church is shortly to have a new instrument, built by William Drake, of Buckfastleigh). Arundel Cathedral (re-instated at the time of the recent restoration) Royal Naval Chapel, Greenwich (retained in the David Wells rebuild, but placed behind the front pipes) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> All Saints Friern Barnet. AJJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcnd5584 Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 All Saints Friern Barnet. AJJ <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Oh yes - that , too. HN&B were always adding chamade stops to their rebuilt instruments. The example at Dunster is a fine stop, as is the similar rank at St. John's, Cambridge. Actually, Gloucester Cathedral almost got a chamade in 1999-2000. In the end, it was rejected because they could not find anywhere to place the chest. I had suggested above the impost, either side of the central tower and facing west. However, at this point David Briggs' eyes narrowed and he said "What, on the front of the historic case, you mean?" His next comment was: "Let's go to the pub." So we did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcnd5584 Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 Incidentally, does anyone know why this board allows indents on quoted posts, but otherwise, justifies left, regardless of what I type? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Coram Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 Well, there are a few more than that: Romsey Abbey (the Tuba is technically a chamade, even if not actually on display) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Ooh! Does that make it a Trompette Miribalis? Sure, there are more. I only mentioned the four I knew of. Actually, 5, because I knew about the Percy Daniel one in Wales. I was driving at a notion that Tubas probably outnumber chamades by about a thousand to one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcnd5584 Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 Ooh! Does that make it a Trompette Miribalis? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> No - but it might make it a Tuba Mirabilis! (Or, how about a Tuba Mirabel?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcnd5584 Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 I was driving at a notion that Tubas probably outnumber chamades by about a thousand to one. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Definitely! But give us time - we can redress the balance.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Coram Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 No - but it might make it a Tuba Mirabilis! (Or, how about a Tuba Mirabel?) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Tubetta Real then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcnd5584 Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 Tubetta Real then. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Sounds like an ice-cream.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vox Humana Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 St Michael's, Kingsteignton also has a chamade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcnd5584 Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 St Michael's, Kingsteignton also has a chamade. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> By whom, VH? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vox Humana Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 Michael Farley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Coram Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 Michael Farley. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Scary stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vox Humana Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 Actually the Kingsteignton organ is scheduled to be a three-manul job. When I saw it a couple of months back the Great Trumpet and the chamade were playable from the Positive manual. The other stops on this manual are prepared for at the console and the pipework present, waiting for a faulty to be installed. That may well have happened by now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcnd5584 Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 Actually the Kingsteignton organ is scheduled to be a three-manul job. When I saw it a couple of months back the Great Trumpet and the chamade were playable from the Positive manual. The other stops on this manual are prepared for at the console and the pipework present, waiting for a faulty to be installed. That may well have happened by now. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> A faulty what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vox Humana Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 Oh dear, my spieling is a bit faculty today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJJ Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 Michael Farley. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> So does Crewkerne - stuck on the west wall - I think we've done this bit somewhere else before though. AJJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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