john carter

Interesting comment, DHM. Can you say more about why you think it is unsuccessful? I would have thought the volume of the box was comparable to a speaker cabinet, so while it might not realistically match sixteen feet of timber, it should be at least as good as an electronic bass. JC

Personally, I have no objection to a digital organ if that is what fits the available budget and some products sound remarkably good. I just think the retention of a few pipe ranks on the basis of "heritage" is pretty pointless given the additional complexity in tuning the digital to match. I sincerely hope it is successful, but it would not have been my preferred option. Having grown up with a Compton, I believe a great deal can be achieved with a relatively small number of extension units and that might have been more appropriate for this building and its musical heritage. It would also probably have been a better investment over a 40 - 50 year term. Much has been written about the shortcomings of extension organs, but when properly designed there are few real conflicts and a surprising amount of flexibility. JC

To me, normally an admirer of all things innovative, the key sentence contained in the document is "Such an organ would be unique in the UK." I would hope those advocating this would ask themselves the question "Why?" I doubt many others would choose to follow this highly dubious route. JC

Now then, now then, Young Peter. Some of us are proud of our origin! (I was actually born at the medical centre within the grounds of Frickley Colliery, close to my grandparent's home, which had in its address, "Near Pontefract". The mine has long disappeared, but the brass band was still going last time I visited.)

My first choice from MM's selection is 7, followed by 6. Of the other alternatives, I would put Vox Humana's number 11 on a par with the Chorzempa. JC

Now, of course, looked after by another renowned husband and wife team! JC

Well, there is one outlet for music that all of us can influence. Then we might have more than three works on the menu! For example, much as I like Saint-Saens 3, why do we never hear the Poulenc concerto? It is very easy to make contact with Classic FM presenters, they are a very approachable lot. Let's start providing suggestions to expand the broadcast repertoire. But it will have to be reasonably digestible stuff to start with. JC

And how big an audience are we talking about - and how many performances of those works are there in a year? The Wagner fans are also fans of particular artistes and long to see the stars perform, just as I was determined never to miss a rare opportunity to hear Dupré or Germani. My point, perhaps not clearly enough made, is that we simply don't have organists with star quality any more. For what ever reason, it is a branch of music that has become almost entirely introspective. My family live in your area, but while I have no difficulty persuading them to join me to hear brass bands, orchestras, string quartets or choral music, I have to drag them kicking and screaming to organ recitals - and when I manage to do so, I understand why. With rare and honourable exceptions they are deadly dull. If you aren't selling the goods in the shop, you must change your offer or give up. In my opinion, the chance of a whole Vierne Symphony inspiring any but those in the business is close to zero. Maybe the answer isn't shorter works, but just one or two organ works within an orchestral concert. I do not know, but I gave my honest answer to the question at the top of the thread. As for whether we are trying to promote the instrument or the repertoire - well pick me up on my choice of words if you must. I do not think it makes a ha'p'orth of difference. Perhaps Widor 5 on the piano accordion would have the crowds flocking in!

I suspect MM's video gives us part of the answer. Unfortunately, there will be some of our number who will be as sniffy about that performance as they are about Carlo Curley or Cameron Carpenter. Who could captivate an audience better than George Thalben-Ball or hold people's attention more than Pierre Cochereau? It was people like that who inspired me as a boy. The trouble is that so many organ recitals now are principally for the pleasure of the performer and his/her friends, not the audience. At one I went to last summer, I sat in the choir stalls as the best position to see and hear, only to be approached by the (well known) organist who told me curtly that he hoped I wasn't going to rustle any papers or shuffle about, because he was recording his recital and the microphone was nearby. What a welcome! If we are going to bring an appreciation of the organ to the general public, we also have to give them something in "bite-size chunks". How many I-player tracks last more than three minutes? Fifteen minutes of Bach on a unchanging registration can be difficult to appreciate, even for afficionados. Every public recital needs to be like an art gallery, where you can find little gems that trigger your imagination among familiar and comfortable works. And it needs a bit of star quality from the performers. Britain's Got Talent... but you would be hard pushed to spot it in our corner of the musical scene. JC

It isn't actually a Compton at Golders Green Crematorium, though there are a couple of Comptons in nearby Churches. It is H N & B, restored by BC Shepherd a few years ago. JC

Further thoughts on organs in Bern - there is a new organ in 2004 by Kuhn in Bern Münster. Professor Heinz Balli used to be the contact, but I don't think he is still titulaire. I am sure he could advise on that and other organs in Bern. Also worthy of note is the 1991 Goll organ in the Église Francaise. I think Philippe Laubscher is the contact there. JC Added later: You might find something of interest here: http://www.echo-organs.org/Fribourg.62.0.html. In particular, the Aloys Mooser organ in St Pierre aux Liens, Bulle is a fairly recently restored and fine instrument played and written about enthusiastically by by Mendelssohn. JC

David Elliott, who is a contributor to this board, is based at the Anglican Church in Lausanne. I would suggest you contact him. JC

Of course, not every organ of note is in a Church or Cathedral. In my opinion, the Royal Festival Hall organ is just as historically important as some of the quaint examples on the HOCS list, yet it does not seem to have been afforded any protection. JC

And Derby Cathedral if I remember correctly. I grew up with instruments using Compton illuminated stopheads and have always been comfortable with them. JC

And if it was my choice, it would be the first source for small but significant savings. I am prepared to be corrected, but I am unaware of anything worthwhile that English Heritage has achieved to date. As to your quote about Dutch hospitals being the best in Europe, I have no doubt they are good, but I would be keen to know the basis on which you make the sweeping claim that they are the best. JC

In case you had not noticed, the government does not have any money - only taxpayers provide money. I hardly think many of them would be happy to have a quango of organ advisors splashing their money around whilst people are dying from cancer for lack of drugs. I am afraid if people really want to preserve organs of genuine value, they will have to be prepared to find the money themselves. JC

I have tried to compose a reply, but words fail me. It's probably just as well.

Sorry, I am quietly screaming now. I can't help thinking that if the ISM represented tube drivers, they would expect them to be paid according to the number of passengers on the train. Surely one "equitable" all-in fee for the job is the more sensible approach rather than this quaint belief that you somehow "own" a performance and have to be rewarded in dribs and drabs whenever it is used, with all the costly overheads and bureaucracy that entails?

Oh, please don't do that. Let's discuss something uncontroversial like Bach's preferred composition of mixtures instead. JC

If, in perhaps half of root canal procedures, filming for and by family and friends was normal practice, I would expect him to get on and do his job without complaint or extra charge.

I think you misunderstand what I am saying. My dentist charges £250 an hour, so I see no problem with a professional organist charging a similar amount for a wedding. Both require skill, training and preparation to perform their job and should be appropriately rewarded. I just think it is silly to distinguish between video and non video. Yes, I do think a wedding photographer is different from a wedding singer and, like the organist, I think a realistic professional fee should be charged. I take the point about long periods of inconceivable tedium in television - it just happens to be the time when other professionals are doing their bit. I am pleased to see the resurgence of live bands but still regret the absence of orchestras from our screens. I am long retired from the business, so things may have changed in recent times.

I am indeed ignoring performance rights because I do not think they are relevant in the case of weddings and funerals. If the resulting tapes were to be exhibited to a paying audience, there might be some justification for a share of the ticket revenue, but we are not talking of celebrity weddings here are we? I think the case for authors and photographers is different. They are manufacturing a product for commercial sale, not providing a service for which they receive a fee. In television I worked in a range of operational posts in studio production before moving into management. In both capacities, I was frustrated by the intransigence of some musicians. In the end, producers could no longer be bothered to employ them.

I am not a professional musician and I don't wish to cause offence, but what additional work is being done that justifies a higher fee? There should be an hourly rate that reflects the number of hours of effort required. As a former broadcaster, I saw a sharp decline in the employment of musicians as a result of unreasonable demands. I'm sorry, double fees just for a video, in this day and age, put me in mind of duck houses and moat maintenance! Take care not to talk yourselves out of a job. JC

But my reading of the text is that Bach liked the vibrancy and tone of Silbermann organs and this comment came after two hours playing on one new instrument. At some time, all of us have sat down at a new instrument and have commented on the voicing. I am sure, even at Worcester, some of our number might have criticised the sound - some might even have felt nostalgia for its predecessor! Taking this comment to suggest Bach criticised all Silbermann mixtures is unreasonable. It also says that Bach admired the powerful organs of Arp Schitger in Northern Germany - what young organist wouldn't? It doesn't tell us what he would have chosen to live with from day to day. JC

This is a very precise statement. Please can you tell me where I can find documentary evidence for this claim? Are they Bach's actual words - or are they, perhaps, the words of an organ builder who was trying to claim some celebrity endorsement and criticise his competitor? A marketing technique not totally unknown even today... JC