kropf

......well....... I am Austrian, but I would like to add a little precision, though: First, you should have to say something to the audience/congregation. It should not be: I am the greatest Improviser in town or in this room (even if its true). You should try to serve. ("We serve" that's pretty English, I think.. Is the Rotary Club an English invention?) There are differencies between concert and service playing. In a concert, one may be more right in thinking "It's all about me!" (the organist). But still not completely right, though. I wanted to encourage those, who see, especially during a service, there is a certain need for improvised music in a certain moment. Than they should fill the gap with their means. "Communicate" joy if it as a joyful occasion, be moderate if you are in lent or in a prayer service for Japan (well, anybody will be...). And, if you just see an opportunity to project your "art" only, refrain from playing. Well, that's for services. Concerts are different, there the "market", i. e. the reaction of the audience, comments in the papers etc. will govern your way as improviser.

Maybe a little Off-Topic again, but.... I just listened to the BBC3 Evensong stream from Eton College, with David Goode playing Bach's B minor P+F as final voluntary. I really have to say, that I enjoyed the playing and the instrument. Of course it sounded even better during the accompaniments, but if I had not found out that it is a (Mander-restored) Hill with full pneumatics, I would have never guessed so. The dark 32' reed during the service would have pointed me into the direction of a very late romantic instrument, but the fresh playing and fine registration of the Bach nearly gave the organ a neo-classical appeal. So this, for me, is another example, where a capable player makes out much more of an instrument than one would expect from it.

Thanks, Nigel! I belong to those who at least had a brief (but informative and humorous!) encounter with your teaching/discussion about improvisation (was it Knokke 1993?). In Germany, Improvisation is, on one hand, highly estimated. But regarded as an art and craft, the music you get to hear covers a VERY broad range, from masterful to horrible - and certainly the latter is most often presented without any questioning of its value... Many books and aids have been mentioned in this thread, the list may be enlarged. But the most important thing is a good ear, and the easiest way to get this is a good teacher. You should refer to good improvisation TEACHERS, not only good improvisers. Both is often found within the same person, but there were and are some known improvisers around who are unable or unwilling to teach. Very gifted musicians will extract the rules of musical art from listening to or reading music or books on it only - imagine a young Mozart, Bach, Mendelssohn... those boys just had to meet the previously written masterpieces and had less need for real persons revealing the mysteries of compositions to them. But that is not us. So try to get a fine ear that can judge well. Among my teachers was one, who had no idea about improvisation didactics, but could comment extremely well on anything I played (beeing a known composer). So I copied the curriculum from another organ class and my teacher than just had to tell what sounded bad. Having tought improvisation for years at three music universities, I am persuaded of another thing: If you do not need just a first-aid pack for basic service playing, you have to go through the whole, the complete history. In academic life, this can be done easily within four years. Why that? Even jazz players, when studying according to the internationally acknowledged Berklee method, they are able to play Dixieland (at the beginning) and hopefully enter contemporary jazz after some terms. But 9 of 10 do not start with 21st c style, as they will always feel they are missing some craft. And in classical improvisation it is the same. I can easily discover in an improvisation of french symphonic style, if the player is able to perform a simple, but correct Bach chorale harmonisation or a simple three part imitiation on the level of a Pachelbel verset. If you understood how to create a useful bicinium following 15th c counterpoint rules, you will succesfully create a two voice piece in a Messiaen scale, or create fine outer lines of a four part harmonisation of a melody, or any own thing, and in any style. Because the basic principles of tension and release, order and exception, they have been valid through centuries. Having said this, I want to encourage everybody out there: Improvise! We have lost so much with that replay-only attitude of the last 100 years. Improvise, and get on your feet to find out how to improve it. As Nigel puts it: Communication, it's all about communication! If there is contact between player and audience, nobody will talk about "errors" in the texture, as long as the audience appreciates what has been communicated between the lines. A player with brave attitude, not beeing arrogant or too much self-conscious, will always try not to exceed his capabilities and so pay his duty by pleasing the audience, how simple the musical outcome may have been. Those who can boast Toccatas, polyphonic movements or impressive atonal chaos (with an inner order, though), go ahead! It is so good that at least our instrument - as the nearly only one within the classical range - has retained improvisation as acknowledged part of its art, which can be found and heard not only on some discs or video clips, but is kept alive by many players many times a week. Try always to stand off that "paging music", extending the acoustical pollution from warehouses, pedestrian tunnels, restaurants etc. into churches or concert halls. Try to communicate, to tell, to comment. And if you do not know what to "say", behave like in real life: Keep quiet. The silence will create the space for new ideas, be they simple or elaborated, be it in the same service or concert, or days or years later...

Briefly: Full accordance with these statements! I came across organs where speech control was possible (mostly small instruments, suspended single-arm action, renovated 17th c and reconstructions) and was educated on such gems, but on most (trackers) it was not possible. What I like with trackers, too, is the contact with the mechanism which makes you feel on the key if the pallet did its job or not. But I already mentioned the large Klais/Steinmeyer/Marcussen organ array of St. Michaelis Hamburg: A beautiful keyboard feeling without any pressure point simulation - it was just long keys and well-adjusted feathers. Regarding feeling and responsibility: I DID NOT MISS ANYTHING! Sure, there was acoustical delay, but as MM pointed out, this may appear on large trackers, too, certainly if you are sitting in a "Spielschrank" in the organs basement, whre you can here an Oberwerk etc. just as a reflection from the walls and vaults, not directly. (MM, you may remember the Bavo/Haarlem Console Situation...!) But this has led as away from Shrewsbury, sorry. Another thing, maybe off-Shrewsbury too: You are aware that there are instruments (mostly medium sized) which where originally full TP, but the first stage was converted to tracker during renovation to ensure reliability. Only the last pneumatic stage (motors) where retained, so that "tubular response characteristics" and the cone chests (talking about continental organs) were kept to somewhat extent. It was said that humidity is an issue in Shrewsbury (a growing one? see the news....). Then one should talk more liberally about technological changes.

It's not always that easy! Take "my" organ: * Built in 1770 by a regional builder, who completely failed in the result of a maybe interesting vision of a 4-man instrument in already somewhat terraced dynamic (Man IV in hood-swell) * Interior completely replaced in 1793 by a better builder, but still not a grand master, developing the 4-man vision * 50 years service without noticeable modifications, but still winding seems to be a issue * ~ 1850 until 1900 small rebuilds mostly on winding, regarded still insufficient * 1908-16 pneumatic chests and new stops added (pedal and new swell division) * 1917 loss of about 50% of the stops ad 70% of the pipe number as "metal contribution" to the war * 1938 electrification of all chests (slider 1793 and cone 1908 - kept because of "historic value" or simply lack of funds?), new pipework (filling the gaps) in Orgelbewegung style, made by a prominent firm, but which already has went over its peak * 1983 the cone chests discarded for EP slider cests, some stops replaced due to anobia damage Today still regarded as beeing to weak tonally, increasing number of problems, and due to chests origin date kbd range is only C-f3. Possible solutions: * keep (instruments and problems) and repair * reproduce the the 1770/1793 state/vision (making use of 11 soundboards from 1793 and two problematic pedal reed stops) - this option favoured by historizing builders, though the knowledge about the original state of the instrument is extremely thin (scaling, pipe materials, action layout and more) and the instrument would be highly speculative * make completely new ("modern", so a fine tracker organ like a Mander would be) behind old facade * rearrange pipework on new soundboards, extend keyboard range, some auxiliary ranks, optimize sound projection (my personal favourite) Everything will be limited by the architecture of the organ, covering the most important sound projection areas with the pedal wings and the giant transept, beeing as large as the nave. The Colloquium of 2009 did not bring any true findings. Shrewsbury seems to be a much easier challenge to decide....

I would even go further and question the ability of tracker action to transmit full control. This is already lost at large trackers, where torsion of action parts becomes quite an issue. Not to talk about wires involved, like in larger Klais organs of past decades. I'm glad to see that tracker is not regarded as the one-and-only action type anymore - well, talking about continental Europe. Britain may never have been endangered to this, as the wipe-out of EP and TP instruments did not happen there in a wa y it did e. g. in Germany.

I raised my voice within this topic because the basic question is touching my everyday-life, at least regarding my organ, which is insufficient in its present state, and it is still to be found out, if it was really better anytime in the past and in one of his previous appearances, or if a completely new instrument should be considered, or - and that's the point linking back to the Shrewsbury organ - not everything should be retained, but existing material put into new technical surroundings. How to find out if the original builder today would agree to modifications or different techniques? How much would have such an expression - if he could use a "time machine" and make any - to be regarded in relation to heritage conservation rules? Many composers, when seeing their work analized by musicologists during their life time, they said: Oh, interesting what you've found out - I never thought about this! (Well, the opposite may have happened even more often...). Would Mr Hill, revisiting Shrewsbury, say and agree, that the interior layout is an issue and a reorganisation could be considered? And that is what he even could have done in his time. But the implementation of an action system unavailable at that time is more difficult to judge. His answer to a proposed state-of-OUR-art electric action can just be fantasized on. What is more important - the original vision or the object/realization? Should one make this organ sound like Hill imagined it during the design stage, or should one restore it to the state of service entry with, obviously, some problems included? If one prefers the (tonal) vision (and is sure what Hill imagined - oh dear...), one should be quite free to modify the instrument in the described manner. (Well, the person should be on same level of skill with Hill...) Serviceability would be supported by Mr Hill's spirit, too, I think. But if the idea of Hill's tonal imagination for this location is unclear to us today, or if a "document preservation" attitude is preferred, a careful restoration should be done. But as reality demonstrates, numberless compromises have been made between these two polarities at many places with a similar question.

Sorry that I join this discussion, lacking any familiarity with that instrument or even with Hill organs or.... I just wanted to say, that there are rare situations coming up, where an original idea could not really be completed in the beginning, and with new means available, the designer's ideas could be fulfilled decades later. This is something which should be considered, but those of you who know Shrewsbury seem not to be sure, if that is necessary. But a more practical thing: If the type of action is somewhat reliable and serviceable - no idea about that, but many on the board are experts - one could have the best of both worlds by restoring and keeping it, but find a certain point in the stop action, where it could be interrupted and interferred by a combination system, working via pneumatic relays, digitally controlled. If the console should remain untouched, the system should be accessed via a separate board on a stand or as a drawer. These "soft additions" are found often in Germany, and to enable a restored pneumatic instrument to store and recall thousands of combinations has been done before, too. The most beautiful and versatile example I know and played is the Marcussen organ of 1914 in the vast St Michaelis church of Hamburg. It has been painstakingly restored and reconstructed to its original state by Philipp Klais, but is fully integrated in the giant three-instrument-array of organs in the church. It is playable tubular-pneumatically from its own console and digitally controlled from the main console. The interior of that organ with its side by side newly-laid tubular pneumatic, discretely supported by electric magnets, is a joy to see. Read the whole story here http://www.klais.de/m.php?sid=123 and jump to the Marcussen.

Not wanting to open a new topic for a small announcement (hopefully no double-posting), but here is another indication for the growing interest in British Organ Heritage abroad: GOArt, the Göteborg/Gothenburg Organ Academy (where that famous Schnitger clone organ was made) has put its 2011 Summer Academy under the headline "The British Organ in the 19th Century". The website is still quite empty, but a rough outline can be found here and there. The Nya Örgryte Church, where the Schnitger clone is situated on the eastern wall, houses a Willis from 1871 (III/31), originating from St. Stephen's Hampstead, London. Present location here. Then there is a Walker from 1907 with 55 stops, (transferred from First Church of Christ Scientist (now Candogan Hall), Sloane Terrace, London) in Kristus Konunges Katolsk Kyrka (Christ the King Catholic Ch). NPOR says 44 stops, but the Swedish website names 45 and 10 borrowings/extensions. (More details about its present state here in Swedish, but with a spec link (Disposition)). Peter Williams (named in the Welcome section), Andrew McCrea and Gordon Stewart are the first names to be found, more information will obviously follow.

You will have understood that it is not only change of the facade, but of main parts of the instruments. Flensburg St. Nikolai church (Schleswig-Holstein, Germany, close to Danish border) comes to mind, where Gerald Woehl recently completed a "double" organ in a beuatiful renaissance case - combining a Schnitger reconstruction with a romantic instrument, using more than 12 pipes for the common stops due to unequal temperament for the Schnitger stops... In Austria they have a small Garnier in a village church. It is very "historical", making use of "Springlade" chests (don't know the English term). It has a nice voicing and fine action, but, regarding the to me yet unknown concept of the Birmingham instrument, one would never expect Garnier to build something large or even symphonic or so. But I've heard that he is very special, so he may still have surprises to give. Don't know if he's still in charge or just his firm is.

Dear members, when the topic was started, we were thinking about travelling cathedrals in England in coming summer. Made aware of the choir holidays and beeing impressed by (re-)reading "The Pillars of the Earth" and watching its movie adaption during xmas holidays on DVD, we thought: Why not travel already in our winter term holidays? So we did, and I want to tell you a litte about it. Most likely there will be no revelation for you in this writing, but maybe the view of a foreigner is of interest for some of you. We stayed for two nights in London and for two nights in Salisbury in nice places. Having arrived Sat 12 Feb in Stansted, we managed to have a brief impression of London's inner city (the kids for the first time in the UK) at lovely weather, and to coincidentally listen to a bellringer rehearsal at St-Magnus-the-Martyr. I am an amateur campanologist and knew quite much about change ringing, but wife and children were stunned. Too bad that the ringers finished shortly after our arrival. I was told later that they were just a visiting group, too. Anyway, the target of our tour was evensong in St Paul's. After reading the discussion about churchwarden's behaviour here on the board, I've already kept an eye on our "exterior appearance" not to be excluded from sitting somewhat closer to the choir (but still we had two rucksacks and raincoats). Well, I have to say, that all staff were very friendly, repeating the same words every 90 seconds to visitors eagerly waiting for evensong admission or asking for the next sightseeing possibility (I find it great that the visited churches restrict sunday to worship only). Then we were let in and took place under the dome. Later the gate to the quire was opened and we were allowed to pass further on. We took place in the stalls some meters from the choir away. The service was as excellent as expected, opening with a wonderfol introit piece (Deo Gratias by van Wilder). From our seating position I could not judge how much of the organ's dome section was used during the service, but it was so fine watching this great choir on short distance. Walton's Chichester Service was a little unexpected in style, but sung in a very interesting and vital manner. Sadly our children were too tired from the day to enjoy it, though they sing themselves in our church. On sunday, after a very impressing visit of the crowded Natural History Museum, we went to Evensong at Westminster Abbey. For me, it was my second time. But entering this church is such a deep impression - well, you all know better. Again, staff was friendly to everybody (well, it was a rainy day and congregation numbers were certainly much lower than during summer season), and we took place in the quire again, now really on the edge of the choir stalls. This way, we had an even more intense impression of the work of the DoM and the several ritual details we are not used to. Again there was excellent music, only the organ voluntary at the beginning sounded improvised to me, or with other words, if it was printed music it should be played sight-reading and not spent much time with it, as it was of comfortable late-romantic "pads", but could have cut off at nearly every point of it. Like in St Paul's the evening before, the Leighton responses were used, so we could here them again and compare. Regarding the organ, which is known to most of you so well: Listening to it live after several years of just bearing its sounds in mind, I was - not for the last time on that trip - reinforced in my opinion, that the sound of "my" organ here in Rostock Marienkirche, which is so often regarded as weak and dim, has some merits when it comes to accompaning choirs, soloists and congregation. It may be a very personal thing, but I prefer a "serving" role of the organ, which normally doesn't exclude it from beeing a capable solistic force. Many new built instruments in Germany are modelled after some french ideas, creating organs which are dominating the acoustical landscape, pushing the listeners capabilities to physical limits in some cases. I was happy, that this my opinion prooved not to be wishful thinking only, but perfectly resembled in english cathedral organs. (Yes, I know, that one can not really compare Westminster to Salisbury etc., but in general you may join this opinion. Of course, the question of position of organ and listener is a different than e. g. in German cathedrals). On Monday, we took a car and left London bound to Salisbury (phew... I prefer playing a Trio Sonata to driving on the left side in unknown terrain AND with the gears on the left...), with a stop in Winchester. I already knew that there would be said evensong only (really "sad" evensong then...), as the choir was on recording session. So we just had a brief look into that magnificent building, enjoyed the town with its - for us - much more familiar size. One gem was left for us to discover: In front of the Castle there was a poster stand saying something about a "40-part motet" by Janet Cardiff. When I went closer to the building, I heard some music from within - o yes, it was "Spem in alium", which is on one of my first CDs ever bought (and frequently listened to). There was free admission to Cardiff's multichannel installation in the castle's Great Hall (the King Arthus table on the wall impressed my son), and it was so touching to hear that wonderful motet in a 40-speaker-arrangement - one per each voice, (ATB sung by single men as usual, and the trebles by few boys(girls too?) per voice of Salisbury Cathedral Choir). What a joy to hear it from center position, as intended by the author, but even more to walk aroung and to listen close to individual choirs or even singers (and occasionally discovering smallest irregularities or errors, making this very technical installation much more human). If you haven't seen/heard this travelling installation, try to get it somewhere. The motet is looped and plays with a three minute break. It will be in Winchester until 20 March. We continued our trip and enjoyed the now smaller roads and villages on our way to Romsey, where I wanted to see the Abbey, before getting to Salisbury. And worth seeing it it was. Though the resources there are already lesser than in larger Cathedrals, there was a warm welcome and flyers for self-gudied tours, and I could even hear some organ sounds, as a lesson was being held. The church offered many possibilities of reflecting the history of mediaeval church building. Then we drove on, and finally, the spire of Salisbury Cathedral appeared ahead, and this was a very solemn moment for us. (We had a nice view unto the cathedral from our hotel room as well). The kids were allowed to stay home (we did not want to overload them with too much service attendance), but my wife and I went to our next evensong. No need to praise the Cathedral Close and the appearance of the at 5.30 already lit exterior there, but I want to name the quite new (2008) font close to the entrance: The congregation is absolutely right in judging it as an important and equivalent addition to the already existing artwork in the cathedral, as it is not only such, but also a symbol of spiritual life, and a living one, as it uses running water. Again, the now really small congregation was greeted friendly. This eve, the girls were in charge, my first experience with a girls choir - and a great job they did! Sitting on the edge of the choir stalls again, the mighty organ made a lot of rumble (especially during the Psalms) making me ask if it would be too much of it in the church. But when I returned the day after, listening to the rehearsal, I learned that with some distance the balance was fine (it was clear that otherwise it would have been already observed by the organists). When exploring the cathedral this second day (after visiting Stonehenge, Devizes, Avebury, and Marlborough, the latters just very brief due to bad weather) with my son, after searching for certain motives in the stone carvings of the wonderful chapter house, and seeing the currently shown installation in the cloisters (thousands of bottles lit in a special way, and again anglican church music is added via discrete loudspeakers), the organ was played in the nave. There was a sort of fugue (quite playful) in e-minor with a tuba entry towards the end of it, and I hoped we could hear the piece again as voluntary in the evening. This second Evensong in Salisbury was again sung by the girls, and my daughter (7) was very impressed by them. (When we told her that we saw girls singing the evening before, she first asked what kind of hairstyle they had! My wife has noticed that they all had long hair, and the second day it prooved true, and we wondered if the need of binding the hair to a ponytail automatically generates the wish among the choristers, to have very long hair then. This time even a girl's beautiful solo voice was heard. For our eyes, the DoM here (D. Halls) seemed to be the most "choir conducting" one - the other two (A. Carwood and J. O'Donnell) conducted by somewhat very high-levelled movements (Carwood), as we would judge it from our training, or very small movements (O'Donnell). The latter was very nice to watch and a lesson for myself, as I always tend to make too large movements. Back to the Salisbury evensong: The final voluntary indeed was the piece rerhearsed during afternoon, and I made my wife aware that there will be an entry of a stop to be found in England only. My daughter just wanted to whisper something to her mum, but when the tuba started in that very moment, she started giggling, affecting her mother, too. Later I asked her about her bad behaviour, and she, not knowing anything about organ stops, answered, that she couldn't resist because of that "Posaune"! Next day we had to return home. The plane left in the evening, so I was looking forward to visit St. Alban's on our way to Stansted (It was a nice anecdote when I asked I guy in a small village's shop how to get to "Stansted Airport" he answered, "Well, this IS Stanstead Abbott!"). We made it to St. Alban's, and so I got back to a place where I've been before, too, when I had opportunity for a concert in St. Saviour's, which must have been before 2000. We reached the cathedral's notice board at 12.28 p.m., reading about an organ concert at 12.30! So we rushed in, the kids spent there time exploring the gift shop in the north transept, while we sat down close to them in the crossing. Peter Dyke from Hereford was already on the pulpit welcoming the audience in a heartly manner and introducing his programme: Postlude in D 105/6 by Stanford, "Herr Gott nun schleuss" by Bach (Neumeister), "Vater unser" by Böhm, Sortie "Adoremus in Aeternum" by Gigout, Fantaisie I by Alain, "Dieu parmi nous" by Messiaen. I knew that the organ has a neo-baroque accent dating back to P. Hurfords design, though somewhat remodelled recently, and I was prepared for the sounds to come. First of all, the concert was played superbly throughout. The programme shew the advantage of a somewhat "universal organ", as the Bach and the Böhm were played with nice articulation and adequate registration, so the only thing missing here for "historic" sound was unequal temperament. Shurely e. g. the Stanford would have sounded even better in Salisbury etc., but could you depict the Böhm there so well? I really love preserved period instruments, but do not hesitate to play Weckmann, Frescobaldi, Bach and Messiaen on the same organ, if it makes out something musical. Well, the more romantic pieces of course came out very well during that concert. My wife just remarked that the Alain colours sounded somewhat "direct" to her. "Dieu parmi nous" was impressive as one was wondering where this rich sound was coming from, regarding the not so large cases of the instrument. Exploring the cathedral after the concert once again opened many dimensions to us, and so this trip was concluded with another major impression. If you have read so far, the summary I wanted to point out for you is: During the four evensongs attended, we experienced - with small nuances - an atmosphere of TRUE PRAYER and WORSHIP, in spite of the danger of falling into routine (This I missed so much e. g. in many services during my catholic time in Vienna's St. Stephen's Cathedral, one major reason for my conversion to Lutheran). We always felt very WELCOME and had the feeling that, as expressed in one of the service sheets, everybody is invited to attend, no matter if he originates from another confession or even from no confession and is just seeking or doubting. My wife and I where so much touched by meeting the treasure of evensong and the buildings, making one becoming part of a chain of faith and worship which is many centuries old, and we deeply acknowlede the daily musical work with the children choristers. We did not completely return from this trip, as for the first time since long, we still remained a little "there" in our hearts, and started thinking how the impressions we received could and would influence our work here with the choirs and the ministry in our church, which is, as a building, a cathedral, too. So thanks to everybody who is engaged in keeping this tradition going. And if it helps anywhere in defeating your church music, you should tell that people from far abroad are coming to England to experience this music. At least we did, and I'm already checking out the places for our next visit.... Thanks for your attention and keep up the good work! Karl-Bernhardin Kropf

Robert Schneider's "Schlafes Bruder" (Brother of Sleep, a worse movie version exists, too) should be available in English, too. It is quite fascinating story of an Austrian mountain village and a young genious with a special gift of hearing, secretly starting to play the organ and even participating in an improvisation contest. The author is the brother to Enjott Schneider, Professor of Movie composition in Munich, who wrote a Toccata "Schlafes Bruder" for that movie. The depiction of a genious in an absolutely provincial surrounding (here: The province of Vorarlberg, the region where the Rieger organ factory is located today) is touching. Wasn't Jules Verne's "20,000 Leagues beyond the Sea" and Captain Nemo from the Nautilus submarine with its house organ mentioned elsewhere?

Hello! From my years at Christ Church Vienna, I remember that the NEH was available in a double spiral binding (maybe called "organist's edition"). (I was angry that this great idea nearly never was adopted by other organ hymn books!). Obviously, it is not available anymore - or could somebody help? Greetings Karl-Bernhardin Kropf

I thought that the direct Synaptel downlink was only in charge when they had their computer crisis at NDdP, shortly after inauguration. As the technology involved is far from beeing extraordinary today, I think everything is working on location now. The "Arpeggio" effect was mentioned above - i. e. that MIDI will always give a serial transmission of a synchronous chord. the thing ist, that in hand-played music you will never fire the contacts (whatever type they may be) of a touched chord simultaneously, so the messages will be transmitted in the order of the fingers as they depressed the keys. Worrying about a "processing delay" when, say, pressing a cluster with arms etc., it has to be noted that it depends on scanning frequency (how often per second all keys of a keyboard are scanned for their current position), and even if scanned VERY often (for the organ of the Teneriffa Auditorium 120 times per second where announced), bad transmission media may slow it down like a slow internet connection. The discussions of these problems have their origins in (much)' older equipment of the pop music branch, where audible delay could occur, certainly with drum and percussion tracks. But the faster the gear is working today, the lesser any delay remains noticeable. Personally, I would try to avoid wireless systems. I do not know about their transmission performance, but having the risk that a mobile phone close to the console or a laptop or any other radiating device could produce unwanted tones or registration changes, would not be a comfortable feeling. Imagine organ competitions on such instruments, where players hack the data of their competitors, adding some (wrong) extra notes...

Anyway, thanks to all the contributors so far! I am aware of the choir holidays, will try to check in advance who is going to sing.... (Beeing accompaning organist to such a substituting choir, I had wonderful days in Derbyshire many years ago...)

Hello everybody! I hope to be allowed to post a question, which seems to be off-topic, but is somehow closely related to the content of this board. Having had some wonderful, though rare impressions from attending services or visiting cathedrals in GB as a single traveller many years ago, our family (children beeing now 7, 8, 16) is considering visiting this area during summer vacation. For us, travelling by car and posting tents on camping sites have proven to be best choice regarding costs and value. I have no idea if the area of southern and middle England is attractive to campers in regard of availability of camping sites and free places there. Brief informations and maybe weblinks are very welcome. Thanks for any help and best wishes for Advent KBK

That's true - I have the Bach b-minor Mass with Gardiner, and somebody's talking during the opening of the "Dona nobis pacem", and in one of the Osannas, there's an error in the trumpets. The play brilliantly, of course. But when you listen often to such recordings (as I did, since it was my first cd ever bought around '86 or '87), you are not free to enjoy as you keep waiting for those "extra events".... So, that is another reason for a clean recording. May it be played clean or edited to seem so.

I once edited someone else's disc, and the "Allein Gott" Trio by JSB (the Klavierübung one) was built from 26 clips from several takes. The performer was simply unable to provide the necessary preparation, but he is the number one in his region (a province in southern Austria), and has his audience, so he made it for them (and it was never available otherwise than directly at his church). I edited several own recordings, and my aim was to transmit my musical view. Two of the three discs where made to present the INSTRUMENT, not the player. The third one was a live recording of an improvisation concert, which was decided to be published two years later - I never thought of doing so during the concert, but the marvellous acoustics and organ were depicted so well in spite of hasty mic arrangement and a large Panasonic SV-3700 DAT (stae of the art in those days). But there is one great musician in history who is the "saint of all editors" - it is Glenn Gould. He was working (originally with experienced staff, later himself) painstakingly on his recordings, searching for the essence of his musical opinion. If a 36 bar piece would need 40 clips and sound fine, he would still be happy. On the other hand, he had not the problem that he might fail as a real-time interpreter at a live performance. So for him, editing was the same as the work of an artist refining his painting or sculpture, or a composer working on his music. I would always make a difference between good recordings and good concerts and the people behind them - there are some musicians who provide both, but many others are better only at one of the two. I took the step to record and edit, because I knew that nobody else would get so much music out of the certain instruments at the time of the recording as I did. That is not ignorant, I simply knew them best. And making other people that much acquainted with the organs that I have already been, would have afforded quite a long time and would have needed money which otherwise could be saved to get most profit out of the projects for raising the organ funds (which has been proven true). On the other hand, I was happy to receive warm reception in articles commenting on the recordings. But I'd never produce or use such discs as enclosure for an application for a concert (which I actually never made in my life), because they do not show my concert abilities. My "cleanest" performance ever was a live broadcast in Austria with BWV 547 with one wrong pedal note, and I hope it was a musical performance though. Mostly there is much more "dirt" in my performances, but audiences like them, as there is much music happening. But sure, there are players who can play clean AND inspired. Some others make their money and reputation by acting as human MIDI machines. We all know to hear the differences. So I would encourage JOR to make a recording even with many edits, if he thinks it serves the organ and its regional reputation - and nobody else is at hand at acceptable prices.... But try to find an engineer with sympathy for the project, because paying a large editing job according to a regular price list and checking the studio clock will always be very expensive.

Some of us may already be aware (or have even followed the voicing process via webcam), that the large Woehl organ beeing built for Pitea University has now its facade completed. www.acusticumorgel.se It is interesting to compare it with the facade of the Woehl of Herz Jesu Kirche München (Munich Sacred Heart), shown here. (Scroll down for lowest pic). Let's hope Woehl has an agreement with the prominent architect for the re-use, as it is identical expect a slight enlargement in width...!

The discussion took already another direction, but my "Sauer a.o."-organ from 1938 has a Scharff in the Swell, I think still from the 1908 rebuild, which has a tierce in the bottom octave only. Could not find a reason for it, too.

The starting question could have been raised easily in Germany, too. Amalgamation can be found very much in the south of Germany, with influences from Italy or France (depending on region), and not to forget the "almost French" style of catholic organs in the southern Netherlands, as on the other hand the "almost North German/Netherlands" style of flemish instruments. Most of the Baltic organ styles, as the Scandinavian, are rooting elsewhere. As somebody said above, there are two streams, one searching for the essence of the past, the other one searching for - well, what should one say? Suiting most needs and organist's wishes? Current new builds of German organs do not offer any contemporary style, except the fact, that the current MIX BALANCE of older styles shows the date of the design. By the moment, it is fashionable to have voices rootin in German Romantic Style, while the fashion of writing Cavailé-Coll stopnames onto the knobs (I mean, rarely we do hear the corresponding sound, too...) is not over. Newly built voix celestes and Trompettes harmoniques can be found in churches of German cities with just 20.000 inhabitants. I frankly confess, that even I am very little engaged in promoting contemporary music, and for the standard audience, the gap between the acceptance of contemporary music and the attractivity of masterworks from the past is bigger than ever. Having an audience preferring to listen to the past, this is a certain brake for the development of contemporary organ building, no matter which European region we are talking about.

A nice collection! Yes, the X-factor is a magical thing. Not organ music, but another example of highest skills combined with much fun in performing is the "Moscow Art Trio" - I do not link a certain clip here, as there are many to choose from, and I could not decide...

Well, such words help me out a little from a small depression I entered into yesterday evening. After a half-hour recital (not played and registrated really well), a man found very critical words regarding the tonal expression of the instrument. I recognised him, a quite succesful writer, book and cd publisher of the organ scene, so he's not somebody without ears and mind. But it interferes with very positive words from the guest musicians from one week before. For such situations, it would be easier if our Sauer-Organ (which one?) would be a little more pure - the optically stunning, acoustically critical organ case and the re-use of baroque soundboards* do not completely generate that sound (yet), which would make a lover of this Oscar Walcker / Victor Gonzalez / Donald Harrison epoque praise it... *Reading the Fritz Heitmann biography again, I think he might have decided to keep the old soundboards not only for reasons of unavailability of new material in 1938 - it could have been his "artistic will", too, if I read between the lines of his essays on some organ projects of his time. Oh, once again we have gone quite off-topic... To set a bridge, I hope that the Woehl organ of Pitea and its rich specification (even wihtout the special harmonics division) will be used not only in the orchestral way, but also to create colors and build them up by creative use of the "normal" mutations - and I hope, their voicing invites to do so.

Dear MM and members, we talked about all these Americans visting European old organs some years ago. When I was holding the post of organist at Hamburg-Neuenfelde (Arp Schnitger 1688, II/34), I started to photograph the precious guestbook, dating from the start of the organ concert series there in 1954. I just made eight pictures which I want to publish now. I think and hope my successor will make the book available to others, as the many pages not depicted keep much more interesting entries (and some less interesting, of course.) Among the eight pages available here there are legible entries of Helen Fountain (Oberlin), E. Power Biggs (Cambridge MA) 2x, Gotthard Arner (Stockholm), Fenner and Jane Douglas (Oberlin), Cor Edskes (Groningen), Luigi F. Tagliavini (Bologna), Arthur Howes (Andover, who travelled Germany and Neuenfelde frequently), Rune Franzen (Stockholm). www.marien-musik.de/guest1.jpg www.marien-musik.de/guest2.jpg www.marien-musik.de/guest3.jpg www.marien-musik.de/guest4.jpg www.marien-musik.de/guest5.jpg www.marien-musik.de/guest6.jpg www.marien-musik.de/guest7.jpg www.marien-musik.de/guest8.jpg It is not a complete "Who is Who" of Organ Art, but there will be few such guestbooks in Europe. Would be nice to have the book online, maybe somebody will make it. As far as I know, they are definately starting the Neuenfelde restauration there. There were rumors about a Hendrik Ahrend job (talented son of legendary Jürgen Ahrend), but I am not sure yet. Have Fun - KBK

While disagreeing regarding the value of old Volvos, I share your Compton fascination! Meeting the Derby Cathedral organ completely changed my opinion about unification, still preferring straight pipework though... Currently I am fascinated by reading "The American Classic Organ - A History in Letters" as part of my "research" regarding Fritz Heitmann (who travelled the US in those days). It is great to read the warm words between Willis and Skinner, and learning they sent each other's products across the Atlantic to share their knowledge. Did not know about J.C. in Italy - interesting! Could have been similar to the projects and research of Abbe Vogler, though more acceptable. While having fun with fine new and old organs, I have growing interest in discovering the 1st half of the 20 century and its organ culture (certainly because of beeing responsible for a quite large instrument of the time), which seems to be of noticeable higher level as was told to us on university... Greetings to Pierre!