Peter Clark
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Posts posted by Peter Clark
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Have you ever noticed how many well-known organists have surnames ending with 'ton"?
Smon f
Adrian Pariingtonton
Carleton Etherington
David Titterington
Iain Farrington
Nichols Kynaston
Any more?
Peterton
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All good things come to an end, including my periodic silences, so here I go with another volley of, as it were, folly.
I bought the score of Steel's Changing Moods recently (for which Banks are to be congratulated; I made my order by phone on Friday afternoon and it was in my hands the next day), mainly for the final movement, Dancing Toccat, an excellent romp. However I am unsure of what to make of the other four movements. They strike me as being very much in the tradition of British organ music of the 60s to 80s in a sub-Matthias kind of way, angular and not always possessing much sense of direction. What does occur to me though is that the harmonic language of the first four movements is at odds with that of the Dancing Toccata. I wonder therefore if the Toccata was written first and the other pieces later in order to make it a sellable "value for money" volume?
Thoughts, anyone?
Peter
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I have recently started learning this piece, almost certainly dating from Messiaen's student days, and I note fron the accompanying booklet to Gillian Weir's recording that there are a number of misprints in the published score which she rectified for her recording. Some are obvious eg tenuto rather than staccato in the final section. Does anyone have information on other misprints?
Thanks in advance
Peter
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Tomorrow (17th Sept) St Peter's in Roath, Cardiff, is holding an open day adn the organ gallery will be open for anyone who wants to see/play the organ. I will be around all day (except for a lunch break) and hope to see some of you there.
Peter
ps for satnavers the postcode is CF24 3BA
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“Immaculate Mary”....gorgeous tune to rival almost any classic Christmas Carol. It’s no more sectarian than saying that Jesus was born in a stable surrounded by wise-men and donkeys. I just invent a descant in the style of David Wilcocks; running all over the place....everyone loves it when I do that.
MM
MM are we talking about the same Immaculate Mary here? The one I refer to is in 3/4 and contains such priceless sentiments as "We pray for God's glory, may his kingdom come! We pray his Vicar, our Father and Rome" .
Now Mary Immaculate, star of the morning to Bach's harmonisations, that's a different thing entirely.
Peter
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PS on The Servant King (not Song, sorry) - there is also that ghastly tritone in the refrain.
(and a suggested descant which sounds like it is from the soundtrack of a 1960s sc-fi B movie.)
P
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Dear Lord and Father is a beautiful hymn, an almost perfect match of words and music (though some irreverent people refer to it as the constipation hymn.) Does anyone know/use Charles Ives' setting of one of the verses, Serenity?
I don't care for Immaculate Mary, which a bit sectarian in this ecumenical age, and the refrain has a once again dreadful example of word setting - a-VEEH, a-VEEH, a-VEEH Mari-AHHH....
How Great Thou Art, as I have remarked elsewhere, promotes a questionable expatiation theology, though the tune is very strong and it is always well sung.
I am unsure about Amazing Grace. Knowing the circumstaces which propmpted is composition (and having seen the excellent film) helps in how moving this can be, but I can't also help feeling the tune is lacking something, and a succesful hymn has rto be a marriahe of good words and good music.
Make me a Channel is anodyne. I canot see anything actually wrong with it and certainly the sentiments cannot be faulted but the music is simply not very interesting.
Morning has Broken. Why do wedding couples want to sing a Christmas Carol at 3.00 on a Saturday afternoon in July?
Peter
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I Watch the Sunrise - bad tune which is never sung properly and words which hardly constitute a hymn.
The Servant Song (From heaven you came....) with abominable word setting in the refrain - ....humble offer-RING we bring them TOOO the Servant King. This caused one well known liturgical musician to question whether English was the writer/compposer's first language.
Bring Flowers of the Rarest
If I were a wriggly worm
The Lord looked down from his window in the sky
Which Be Still do you mean though? Be Still and Know or Be Still for the Presence of the Lord? If the latter, I think this one of the best comtemopary hymns.
The Lord's my Shepherd to Crimond with that awful pause between lines 2 and 3 (though I can never play the other tune without imagining Edward Woodward in The Wicker Man!)
More to come I hope!
Peter
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And what about the 32ft flue on the Peter Collins organ in Edinburgh? Rumble may be a description but in this case is what it actually says on the knob.
PJW
The 32' at Llandaff is a sock-knocker-offer (I know because when I used it for the first time I thought the cathedral was about to collapse!) so they have a quint to make sure that the building stays intact. I used it on paged two of Howells PP 1, last system, just the one note as indicated. Great feeling!
P
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When was the organ built?
It would appear that if this console makes Cortege et Litanie easier to play, this would be a further benefit of keeping it?
I am certainly not advocating getting rid of it! I love it these days. As I said, one can adapt to it quite quickly. Also it is of historical interest. Tomorrow I am going to try some other music on it, maybe the Yon Toccata for flutes which I think will work well (the organ has no mutations but two mixtures, great and swell, the former needs to be used only now and then as I think it a bit fierce, as is the Great 2', but the swell 8 and 2 combined is most effective).
On the bummer side, my regular chuch, St Peter's Roath, was targetted by lead thieves at the weekend and so the damage to the roof caused rain to get onto the organ gallery. No real harm thankfully but the pedalboard had to be removed as water was getting under it. The most harm seems to have been done to the porch.
Tony N and others have said that this is not uncommon these days.
Vandalism seems rife though. When I got home about an hour ago I found that someone had put dog poo (or possibly worse) into my food recycling bin. Swines, ignorant and antisocial bleeps.
Not really our forum's remit but just wanted to let off steam!
Peter
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The depth of touch in the keys could also make a big difference to a stretch like this. A deep touch could make it very difficult not to snag the tenor A.
Another problem is that the fourth finger can inadvertantly glance the manual above if the overhang is too great!
Peter
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The 8th bar ort the Litanie section in Dupre's Cortege et L:itanie has a very awkward LH - from tenor B to low G# but with a tenor G# and D# as well.I find this easier with a coupled pedal but no pedal stop suppplying the lower G# and then bringing the pedal 16 (still coupled) on for the next bar. However on the St Alban's organ (and, Tony N, I will provide a full spec soon, if not a history) this LH bar is unproblematic.
Peter
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Paul Hale at St German's. Cardiff on Wednesday 15 June, 7.30. I have no details of the programme yet.
Peter
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I play regularly at St Alban's in Cardiff and in fact am due to give a recital there in a few weeks. One thing that I have been aware of over the years that I have played there is that the keys are slightly narrower than standard (which on the plus side means that chords over the octave or tenth are more comfortable to play) and I wonder if this is common. The organ was rescued from a redundant Baptist church in the vicinity and recently restored by Deane; but for some reason the church wanted to retain the original console* which as I said does not seem to conform to standard dimensions. It is not uncomfortable once you get used to the variation just mentioned (and the pedalboard seems to be standard RCO). Was there a time when manual dimenions were eventually standardised and are there other examples around of "deviations" from what we now would consider the norm?
Peter
*perhaps for financial reasons
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I think, H, that we have sufficient evidence to support the view that Carrick does not possess the grace and tact to voice his or her disagreements with other forum members in a civilised fashion. We organists (and other valued contibutors here) will inevitably collide on certain issues but I have always found that when this happens it happens with courtesy, sensitivity and in a spirit of mutualy supportive friendship.
I think that this thread should either be locked, or that Carrick should withdraw from the discussion board - or perhaps be withdrawn. And given his or her asterisked expletives, not to mention his or her overall offensive tone, I am surprised that the latter has not yet happened.
Peter
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The point surely is not one of discussing the merits of Curley or Dixon but the langauge used. Yiou can love Carlo and Reg or you can hate them (or at least their playing) but introducing ad hominem arguments with words such as "snobbish" or "disgrace" is not acceptable.
What is snobbish anyway? I love Bach, Messiaen, Dupre; I also love Bob Dylan, Tom Waits and The Beatles. There are organists who do not like the last three. There are pop fans who do not like the former trio.
Are the non-likers of the former any more snobbish than their likers, or the non-likers of the second trinity more snobbish than the likers?
I am not a G&S fan. Some organists I know are. Does that make me a snob?
I am a Miles Davis and fan. Some organists I know are not. Does that make them snobbish?
I am also a Dr Who and Star Trek fan. Some organists I know.... and so on.
The only disgrace this forum has suffered recently is the description of it as being a disgrace.
Which it is not.
Peter
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I know not whether I speak for others too, but this is now exceeding boring.
As for the assertion that this forum is a disgrace: it was fine, before: draw whatever conclusion you may from that.
DW
Hear hear! Having been an active member of this forum for quite a few years now I have rarely seen anything approaching the implied condemnation of the vast majority of its participants by applying the word "disgrace". Had I been a moderator the remarks from Carrick would have attracted my censure long before now. I feel that it may be time for the moderating team to take some action.
Peter
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Do you think it's going to be the driest summer on record?
Possibly. There seems to be a cold front though surrounding Manderville, but a sudden surge of moderation would be welcome.
P
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I must be one of a handful of British organists who once wrote a piece for theatre organ, and the late Bill Davies played it and enjoyed it very much. (Dedicated to Ena Baga, incidentally).
When people tell me that I talk rubbish, I don't feel very inclined to repeat the exercise with a second composition; not that many theatre organists could play the first one.
As for my written arrangement of "Nola," which manages to work in simultaneously the tune of "Polly," with snatches of "Ain't she sweet" and "Put me amonhgst the girls," it does require a certain trio-sonata technique, which at a guess, would confuse all but two or three British theatre organists.
MM
MM, I, and I am sure others. would love to see these pieces of yours of which you speak. Any chance of that?
For my money, John Giacci takes some beating though Richard Hills' Tiger Rag which you posted in phemomenal.
Peter
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So what have YOU struggled with?
MM
Dupre Cortege et Litanie. Fine until halfway down page 5 when the feet have to leap about in jumps of a fifth. But then most peoples' problems begin there so I am told by one who has recorded it (on YouTube). Even now I can only guarantee an accurate rendering of this passage about 7 times out of 10. This I put down partially to a mental block I seem to have acquired about this section of the piece. But that's probably a topic for another thread. The individual parts are not tricky (though the RH part seems to defy any attempt at anything like legato though my teacher told me that a detached affect is what the composer probably intended. The LH part is just a series of chords and the pedal part on its own is not difficult, but it's the playing of all three simultaneously. The bottom line of page 7 and the top of page 8 - those repeated top bs in the pedal rarely seem to come off totally error-free.
That'll do for now I'm sure. I look forward to reading other members' contributions to what looks like being an interesting thread and one in which we might not impossibly offer suggestions.
Peter
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No, I believe he was trained as a classical organist initially, but his music, (of very high quality), was exclusively (I think), in the light category.....nothing wrong with that. I know someone who knew him, so I may be able to find out second-hand rather than third-hand. I also seem to recall that Anderson was very much the intellectual.....languages at Harvard?
Another is Rick Wakeman of "Tubular Bells" fame, but how "classsical" he is, I am not sure.
MM
Additional information discovered in about ten seconds:
http://www.leroyanderson.com/biography.php
His mother was also an organist apparently.
I notice he only spoke half-a-dozen languages. A former partner of mine was fluent in fourteen.
Bloody Harvard graduates!
MM
Thanks MM for the Anderson info.
Wasn't Tubular Bells by Mike Oldfield? Not sure about his musical background though.
P
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Try this for perfection in transcription-playing, with music by Leroy Anderson: possibly the wealthiest organist ever, with such hits as "Blue Tango" and "Sleigh Ride."
MM
Just spotted this - I didn't know that Leroy Anderson was an organist - presumambly a theatre organist?
Peter
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As I understand it this forum is not just for organists but for anyone interested in the organ and its music (and many of the organists here also reflect on their other interests, topics as diverse as steam trains and Dr Who!).
So a warm welcome and I hope you will gain something from your membership here, and also that you contribute your own thoughts from time to time!
Peter
Sanctuary (TV show)
in General discussion
Posted
Greetings everyone;this is the latest of my one of my now increasingly infrequent submissions to this forum, but only because health is not good. Not looking for sympathy but what I am looking for is the score for the heme tune of the TV series Sanctary which aired about 35 years ago, set in a convent. I do not know who wrote the music.
Any help please?
Thanks
Peter