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Martin Cooke

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I'm speaking from a purely Australian perspective here but i've recently had great experiences with Ahlborn-Galanti instruments. They did a fantastic installation at a church in Newcastle and also recently installed a large 3-manual with added pipe ranks at Newcastle University. They also do wonderful wooden keyboards, which may not seem much, until you've played on them.

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I'm speaking from a purely Australian perspective here but i've recently had great experiences with Ahlborn-Galanti instruments. They did a fantastic installation at a church in Newcastle and also recently installed a large 3-manual with added pipe ranks at Newcastle University. They also do wonderful wooden keyboards, which may not seem much, until you've played on them.

 

I agree with you about the keyboards, although like virtually all builders, the keyboard are sourced from Fatar of Italy. Whilst the cheapest keyboards are really horrid, the wooden ones are sublime to play. Although they are horrendously expensive in comparison.

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And the other vexed question I had with the Wyvern System was it couldnt play more then ten notes on the manuals !

 

Which system? If you are talking about the Phoenix system then you can have as many notes as you like on the manuals play at once - it just depends upon how many stops are put on each tone-card. The new tone cards are twice as large (in memory terms) as the old ones, so it's is extremely unlikely that you would ever find this. However, if the organ is badly designed from the off, then you could exhaust the available memory on the card, and get missing notes. I'm not aware that this has ever happened before, but you may have found the first......

 

Anyone could find this on any organ (including pipe) when you have to play (as I do today) the organ part for the Karl Jenkins 'the Armed Man' where it calls for the organist to lay both forearms upon the manuals and both feet sideways on the pedalboard, with the organ flat out.

 

Oh dear.......

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Guest Lee Blick
'the Armed Man' where it calls for the organist to lay both forearms upon the manuals and both feet sideways on the pedalboard, with the organ flat out.

 

:lol:

 

I wonder what the piece would be called if Jennifer Bate was spreadeagled over the manuals and pcnd was kneeling on the pedals....

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I agree with you about the keyboards, although like virtually all builders, the keyboard are sourced from Fatar of Italy. Whilst the cheapest keyboards are really horrid, the wooden ones are sublime to play. Although they are horrendously expensive in comparison.

 

Seeing that all there is on the end is an on/off switch, I'm surprised a standard P&S keyboard couldn't be used - the toggle touch ones are extremely pleasant.

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Seeing that all there is on the end is an on/off switch, I'm surprised a standard P&S keyboard couldn't be used - the toggle touch ones are extremely pleasant.

 

Most of them will have a velocity sensor too, I believe, as some builders do try to model in attack/release.

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Anyone on any advice on touch?
See above. But I would suggest that just as important as touch is the question of durability.

 

My toaster came with cheap Italian keyboards in which the return of the key after lifting the finger was managed by a plastic nipple/bubble under the key. Depressing the key depressed the nipple, which sprang back to its original position when the pressure was removed. These nipples were prone to splitting whereupon you would get nasty clicking noises fro the keys. After I had had my keyboards replaced for about the third time Wyvern persuaded Fatar (presumably) to redesign the keyboards, which they did. The new keyboards were vastly improved. The touch actually felt almost tracker-like since the nipples provided a definite point of resistance. However, although durability was improved they still eventually went the way of the other keyboards. The only difference is that they took longer to fail and the clicking is not so evident (it's there, but not overly distracting). The real bummer is that there is no feel in the keys. Eventually this will damage your technique.

 

My advice: whatever else you compromise on, get the best keyboards you can afford. If you don't you'll regret it.

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Guest Psalm 78 v.67
We know him ! Its him that comes to service our Organs pretty expensive ! Theres a call out fee before any work is done and then the cost of the repair.

 

Won't Viscount come themselves? Now they are in Bicester it's not that far... They will come to my church in the SE corner of the country, although to save on callout costs, they suggest an independent engineer in Kent who is very reliable.

 

PLEASE NOTE THAT I HAVE EDITED THIS POST - I HAD OMITTED HALF A SENTENCE THAT THEREFORE GAVE TOTALLY THE WRONG IMPRESSION!

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Won't Viscount come themselves? Now they are in Bicester it's not that far... They won't come to my church in the SE corner of the country though.

 

 

No. Because we brought these Viscounts from Wolverhampton Organ Centre . Although they sold them through the dealership for Viscount in Watford. ... [edited by moderator] manufacturers should design their organ so the fuses are easy to get at should one go in and emergency. So u could probably change one if u have some to hand .

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For all those melomaniac Organists that like to belt it out with full Organ drawn for a long period. It only takes one in internal fuse to blow and your without your instrument.

 

.......and many is the pipe organ which has dropped out in the middle of a wedding when the blower contatactor won't stay in. Osmonds are the worst for this, with organs which have their blowers in little 'shed' on the outside of the church a close second! I would say that running outside in the pouring rain (as I have had to do on more than one occasion) is just as awkward - and embarrassing-

 

Royston does a fairly good job for us but as Ive said he can be expensive.

 

How expensive?

 

Relative to what, pray?

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No. Because we brought these Viscounts from Wolverhampton Organ Centre . Although they sold them through the dealership for Viscount in Watford. ... [edited by moderator] manufacturers should design their organ so the fuses are easy to get at should one go in and emergency. So u could probably change one if u have some to hand .

 

The fuses aren’t easy to get at for safety reasons. If the fuse has blown because of an equipment problem, chances are the replacement fuse will also blow. If the replacement fuse is the wrong rating (too high), then you could damage the organ and/or organist. It’s better to have the organ checked out before replacing the fuse. :)

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This post by Ronald Shillingford (05:03 yesterday), above, had to be edited by the moderator because there was too much in it that could be construed as defamatory (and it included at least three individual's full names and enough detail to identify them).

 

 

Many apologies Mr Mander. It didn't cross my mind at the time of commenting. It was unprofessional of me to quote a persons name and character. So thanks for editing out I havent got the funds for a libel case lol.

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Having been in the pipe organ trade for a very long time, I was never blinkered as to developments in the `electronic’ side but until `digital’ came on the scene never regarded them as a serious contender as a passable substitute for a pipe organ.

 

None of us would dispute that a good large pipe organ takes preference over the sounds that are electronically generated – but with a large enough generating system and sufficient, properly placed speakers remarkable results can be obtained these days.

 

Unfortunately with pipe organs, the repairing and rebuilding of them cost money and spacewise they take up much room. Many British churches, unlike the lofty Continental churches with superb West End sites and acoustics, do little to help a pipe organ’s installation.

 

There is a country parish church near here contemplating a new 3 manual pipe organ for which a gallery will have to be built to accommodate it costing in all around some £400,000. As much as I love pipe organs, for this particular church I fund it hard to morally justify this expenditure. (With the threatened alterations to the Clergy Pension Funds I cannot see the Revs being too keen either).

 

I have been reading with interest the remarks made on the Electronic thread. A few of them seem to lack thought or logical conclusions.

 

Some two years ago we had to do something about our church instrument which:

 

1. Was hopelessly positioned at the rear of the vestry with, restricted tonal egress, no contact with the congregation with nowhere else in the church to put it.

 

2. Had a very heavy mechanical action and limited specification.

 

3. Needed a minimum of £25,000 to make any real improvement and after that expenditure would still be wrongly positioned.

 

We decided to go `Electronic’ and went for an Eminent, the two manual console being placed just in front of the chancel steps. There are speakers at the rear of the nave and in the chancel that can be used independently if required. At last I do not now feel as if I am playing in the next parish.

 

The reason we went for it is that that the organ is truly voiceable and was within our budget. We have got it making a pretty good sound, tailored to our needs with a comprehensive specification. The only drawback being that I have had to relearn my version of the Widor! It cost us some £17,000 including the building work for positioning the speakers.

 

 

I have read the various criticisms of Eminent organs with interest. The Southampton installation, which is condemned by `bombarde 32’, is said to be ten or more years old and is therefore a quite early digital installation. At the time it probably sounded very good for their stage of development and it is not really fair to compare it to what can be achieved today.

 

Plymouth Cathedral comes out well, but that is now 10 years old and from my recent experience if they call the Eminent experts in I am sure the note transient situation could be sorted out.

 

`Psalm 78 v 67’ moans about a having a Chimney Flute 8 and Rohr Flute 4 on the same manual on a Crematorium organ. If it worries him that much he needs to find out who accepted it in the first instance and the get the Eminent people to alter (revoice) one of the stops to his liking.

 

I have played many modern `digital’ installations from various makers that have been very successful and also some not quite so. I can only speak for my church and say that our Eminent has revolutionised the music, sounds well, suits our needs, was within the amount the church was prepared to spend - and did not go out of tune in the recent hot spell.

 

FF

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Guest Psalm 78 v.67
`Psalm 78 v 67’ moans about a having a Chimney Flute 8 and Rohr Flute 4 on the same manual on a Crematorium organ. If it worries him that much he needs to find out who accepted it in the first instance and the get the Eminent people to alter (revoice) one of the stops to his liking.

 

FF

 

The crem in question (Hastings) does not have any "resident" organists - funeral directors have to find and book an organist when required, so no one organist can be blamed for "accepting" it.

 

My "gripe" is not the voicing; rather that as I understand it "Rohr" is German (I think) for "Chimney" so why not call them both Rohr or both Chimney (as on the Wyvern at N Fortin's church) if that is what they emulate.

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I've looked at the spec, and am interested to see 2 Chimney Flutes on the choir at 8' & 4'. Do they differ at all tonally, and is there a pipe-organ precedent for this duplication of names at different pitches on the same department?

I missed this. May I just say "Naumburg"?

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With regard to the same stop name being used at two different pitches on the same manual - do I recall wrongly, or was there a Leiblich Gedact at both 8ft and 4ft pitches on the old RCO Organ? A friend who took his ARCO on the instrument commented to me that he got confused and drew the wrong one - I think. Anyone know if my memory is correct?

 

Regards to all

 

John

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Here is another one - one could almost take it home - 'some lovely sounds and all a little different.

 

'Just spotted the theme for this thread - we're a bit off topic!

 

AJJ

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