Jump to content
Mander Organs

Why Is It Called A Tuba?


john carter

Recommended Posts

My thought ... 'Tuba' is so much easier to engrave on a stop knob. Euphonium is just asking for trouble.

Open Diapason is sometimes a bit of a squash, as are Keraulophon, Clarabella, Ophicleide, Double Open Diapason, Grand Fourniture, and I'm sure many others. Perhaps we should stick to stops with short names although an organ that contained only Sext, Terz, Flyt, Oboe, Bass, Horn and Tuba might be a challenge.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Patrick Coleman

On the Tamburini at the English College in Rome, there is an 8' stop called Eufonio, situated in fourth place among the stop tabs after Principale, Ottava and Ripieno, and before the flutes and strings. It is best described as a booming sort of diapason, too thick to be much use with the main chorus ranks. It is not a reed, and nowhere near sounding like a tuba. Any suggestions on its parentage (polite ones of course?) ;)

Link to post
Share on other sites
On the Tamburini at the English College in Rome, there is an 8' stop called Eufonio, situated in fourth place among the stop tabs after Principale, Ottava and Ripieno, and before the flutes and strings. It is best described as a booming sort of diapason, too thick to be much use with the main chorus ranks. It is not a reed, and nowhere near sounding like a tuba. Any suggestions on its parentage (polite ones of course?) ;)

 

Diapason phonon ?

Link to post
Share on other sites
-Again- what means "musical" ?

We may understand that differently, because it refers

to taste, not facts.

 

Pierre

 

This is true - up to a point. However, I would suggest that there are certain facets of my description which are factual statements. The stop in question lacked harmonic development; I think that it would also be difficult to deny that the sound was somewhat opaque and oleaginous.

 

There are a number of Tuba stops on instruments in this country which are able to function as powerful solo stops, yet have a better harmonic development and a brighter sound. These stops are also far removed from the type of Chamade ranks which I know you dislike. The Tuba stops on the Solo Organ at Salisbury Cathedral have been mentioned by a number of us, for example.

Link to post
Share on other sites
There are a number of Tuba stops on instruments in this country which are able to function as powerful solo stops, yet have a better harmonic development and a brighter sound. These stops are also far removed from the type of Chamade ranks which I know you dislike. The Tuba stops on the Solo Organ at Salisbury Cathedral have been mentioned by a number of us, for example.

 

And at Lincoln (as I have written before) where they can also just be used as 'super' Great reeds occasionally. 'Tried this once though at Salisbury though and it did not work - nice stops but much power!! The friend who was playing was mercifully not of a nervous disposition.

 

AJJ

Link to post
Share on other sites
My thought ... 'Tuba' is so much easier to engrave on a stop knob. Euphonium is just asking for trouble.

 

H

 

 

==========================

 

 

I suspect that the organ-builder John Clough would not have the slightest problem labelling a stop Euphonium!

 

He could probably do it with his eyes closed, and wet the sticky label with an expert triple-tongue technique!

 

;)

 

MM

Link to post
Share on other sites
This is true - up to a point. However, I would suggest that there are certain facets of my description which are factual statements. The stop in question lacked harmonic development; I think that it would also be difficult to deny that the sound was somewhat opaque and oleaginous.

 

So this is un-musical:

 

http://www.aeoline.de/Wemmetsw_MP3/Hohlfloet_HW.mp3

 

.....While this is musical:

 

http://www.aeoline.de/Wemmetsw_MP3/Gambe_HW.mp3

 

The brightest, the "best", so we may suppress the half of

the organ tone colors.

 

Pierre

Link to post
Share on other sites
So this is un-musical:

 

http://www.aeoline.de/Wemmetsw_MP3/Hohlfloet_HW.mp3

 

.....While this is musical:

 

http://www.aeoline.de/Wemmetsw_MP3/Gambe_HW.mp3

 

The brightest, the "best", so we may suppress the half of

the organ tone colors.

 

Pierre

Pierre, I think you are taking pcnd's point too literally, but I am sure he will answer in due course. As far as the flute sample is concerned, I would not find that timbre of stop useful. I consider this one much more musical:

 

http://www.aeoline.de/Mp3/franz_orgel_mp3/...lute%20harm.mp3

 

JC

Link to post
Share on other sites
So this is un-musical:

 

http://www.aeoline.de/Wemmetsw_MP3/Hohlfloet_HW.mp3

 

.....While this is musical:

 

http://www.aeoline.de/Wemmetsw_MP3/Gambe_HW.mp3

 

The brightest, the "best", so we may suppress the half of

the organ tone colors.

 

Pierre

 

Not at all - I do not dislike either, although I would want some regulation carried-out on the Gambe. However, I must confess that my preference is for the Flûte Harmonique sample, which John Carter linked. See below.

 

I believe I was referring to a particular Tuba stop on the organ of Downside Abbey, Pierre. I can see no connection betwen this and the sound files which you linked - and which I had not heard prior to posting my response above.

 

For the sake of clarity, the point which I was attempting to make was that, if one does require a Tuba, there were a number of better examples, which had a brighter and less opaque tone, yet were not remotely like the type of Chamade stops which I believe that you dislike. I cannot think of a clearer - or less ambiguous - way to express this.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Pierre, I think you are taking pcnd's point too literally, but I am sure he will answer in due course. As far as the flute sample is concerned, I would not find that timbre of stop useful. I consider this one much more musical:

 

http://www.aeoline.de/Mp3/franz_orgel_mp3/...lute%20harm.mp3

 

JC

 

Thank you, John!

 

I love the Flûte Harmonique! Could you tell me on which organ it resides, please?

Link to post
Share on other sites
Not at all - I do not dislike either, although I would want some regulation carried-out on the Gambe. I must confess that my preference is for the Flûte Harmonique sample, which John Carter linked. See below.

 

I believe I was referring to a particular Tuba stop on the organ of Downside Abbey, Pierre. I can see no connection betwen this and the sound files which you linked - and which I had not heard prior to posting my response above.

 

Indeed you are right about the Gamba; it needs regulation (this was done

afterwards).

The connection with the Tuba is simple; as we have dark and bright colors within

the flues, so we need among the reeds.

About 75% of the organ palette has been forbidden by the "Reform", and we need

them back.

 

Pierre

Link to post
Share on other sites
Thank you, John!

 

I love the Flûte Harmonique! Could you tell me on which organ it resides, please?

Delightful isn't it? I'm not sure where it was recorded, I just found the sample on the site from which Pierre had linked the others. The only clue I have is a reference on the screen to Rochas - perhaps Pierre Rochas, who apparently produced an organ dictionary with two accompanying CDs, but that's only guesswork Holmes! Pierre L. may know.

JC

Link to post
Share on other sites
On the Tamburini at the English College in Rome, there is an 8' stop called Eufonio, situated in fourth place among the stop tabs after Principale, Ottava and Ripieno, and before the flutes and strings. It is best described as a booming sort of diapason, too thick to be much use with the main chorus ranks. It is not a reed, and nowhere near sounding like a tuba. Any suggestions on its parentage (polite ones of course?) :)

On German instruments of the turn of 19/20th century you will occasionally find a Hornprincipal - sort of overscaled principal...

Link to post
Share on other sites
Delightful isn't it? I'm not sure where it was recorded, I just found the sample on the site from which Pierre had linked the others. The only clue I have is a reference on the screen to Rochas - perhaps Pierre Rochas, who apparently produced an organ dictionary with two accompanying CDs, but that's only guesswork Holmes! Pierre L. may know.

JC

 

See here:

 

http://www.organartmedia.com/CCMainz-Intro.html

 

Pierre

Link to post
Share on other sites
Not at all - I do not dislike either, although I would want some regulation carried-out on the Gambe. However, I must confess that my preference is for the Flûte Harmonique sample, which John Carter linked. See below.

 

I believe I was referring to a particular Tuba stop on the organ of Downside Abbey, Pierre. I can see no connection betwen this and the sound files which you linked - and which I had not heard prior to posting my response above.

 

For the sake of clarity, the point which I was attempting to make was that, if one does require a Tuba, there were a number of better examples, which had a brighter and less opaque tone, yet were not remotely like the type of Chamade stops which I believe that you dislike. I cannot think of a clearer - or less ambiguous - way to express this.

 

 

====================

 

 

Well, I can only repeat my love of H,N & B Trumpet Majors; such as at Bradford Cathedral.

 

Low down, they have body enough for Tuba-esque solos, whilst higher up, they have real fire and brilliance.

 

Easily the best type of climax stop ever made, but they never seemed to catch on. Instead, sad old romantics stuck to their beloved Tubas!

 

MM

Link to post
Share on other sites

The problem with organ stops is that you can't generalise or reliably predict how a stop will sound based on its name. The Tuba at Hereford, for example is a bright and brilliant sound and not at all thick in its texture, whereas I suspect the prejudice against stops of this name is because they are perceived to be podgy.

 

Two examples from my neck of the woods which have received, thus far, no mention are the Tuba Mirabilis at Bath Abbey, a pre-Klais stop with its own blower, which is of considerable magnificence, and the Trumpet on the solo organ at Bristol Cathedral, which I seem to remember from a previous discussion thread, is engraved "Tuba" on the pipework. These are very different stops. No one in their right mind would want (or possibly need) to couple the Tuba at Bath Abbey through to the Great and Swell tutti, whereas the trumpet at Bristol is an integral part of the unique, glorious, and somewhat heavy tutti of that unique instrument.

 

The solo tuba on the reknowned H&H in St. Mary Redcliffe is also a very bright and brilliant stop, although for service accompaniment the availability of a slightly gentler solo trumpet would be a blessing.

Link to post
Share on other sites
... Two examples from my neck of the woods which have received, thus far, no mention are the Tuba Mirabilis at Bath Abbey, a pre-Klais stop with its own blower, which is of considerable magnificence, and the Trumpet on the solo organ at Bristol Cathedral, which I seem to remember from a previous discussion thread, is engraved "Tuba" on the pipework. ...

 

The Solo reed at Bristol is named 'Tromba 8', according to the draw-stop. It is unenclosed - as is the 8ft. Harmonic Flute on the same clavier.

 

It is really the sounds of certain solo reeds which I do not like, regardess of their nomenclature. Many older H&H Tuba stops are often rather opaque and very loud. I do not think that I have heard the example in St. Mary, Redcliffe.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...