Guest Hector5 Posted February 17, 2008 Share Posted February 17, 2008 Today I finally reached what must be my own personal seventh heaven, having finally played the Mutin Cavaille Coll at Meursault, through the kindness of their organist. Contrary to my previous posts about the organ, the updated stoplist is: MANUAL 16 Bourdon 8 Diapason Bass 8 Diapason Dessus 8 Flute Harmonique 8 Salicional 4 Prestant IV Plein Jeu 16 Tuba Magna Bass 16 Tuba Magna Dessus 8 Trompette 4 Soprano (actually a Clairon) PEDALE 16 Soubasse PEDALS Soubasse Appe Anches Tir. Manual My goodness, what an organ! Leaving the reeds aside, this is an organ with real presence and seems to effortlessl accompany a full congregation singing (yes - even French sing in Meursault!) on just the principals 8 and 4. The reeds are absolutely terrifying at the console. The whole instrument is only as deep as the diminuative console, with two sets of well shutters, one set on the front of the case, the other set opening at the back and firing off the west wall. On my drive into Meursault this morning, I listened to a French mass on the radio which seemed to have a two manual spit and squawk attempting to accompany, and very badly. Dynamics were achieved by the addition of pitches rather than colors. In short, it was awful - until I stepped into Meursault church, were I was wrapped in the warm embrace this fabulous organ. I tried everything I could throw at it, and it coped beautifully. Only double manual stuff (tricky stuff) really had to be left at the bottom of the stairs. Otherwise you simply cannot fault this organ. Oh, the console action adn pedalboard was sooooooooooooo comfortable. I've been on cloud 9 ever since my visit, and can't wait to get back there. Putting size aside - has anyone else experienced a 'cloud 9' moment with an instrument. Best wishes from sunny Burgundy. Hector Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Barry Williams Posted February 17, 2008 Share Posted February 17, 2008 "Putting size aside - has anyone else experienced a 'cloud 9' moment with an instrument." In no particular order: 1. Liverpool Cathedral 2. St Philip's Cosham 3. St Michael's Abbey Farnborough Barry Williams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Cynic Posted February 17, 2008 Share Posted February 17, 2008 [quote Has anyone else experienced a 'cloud 9' moment with an instrument? /quote] Oh yes....! In no particular order: Blenheim Palace - Father Willis Abbatiale Sainte Croix, Bordeaux - Dom Bedos, restored Pascal Quoirin Westerkerk, Amsterdam - Duyschot 1686 rebuilt Vater etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest spottedmetal Posted February 17, 2008 Share Posted February 17, 2008 Has anyone else experienced a 'cloud 9' moment with an instrument? Yes! You might have seen the Venice thread. WOW! That instrument in a beautiful classical building with a reverb exceeding 7 seconds - an instrument with a single manual, diminished pedalboard, thin case and probably 20 diminishing stops (haven't counted) - yes could have played all day . . . and possibly be satisfied for life . . . . possibly even worth becoming a monk for . . . . ! Is the cloud 9 moment simply a novelty unexpected refreshment to our ears? Can it be permanent? Or does it give us inspiration to hear, listen and play other instruments with new ears? Best wishes Spot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MusingMuso Posted February 17, 2008 Share Posted February 17, 2008 Putting size aside - has anyone else experienced a 'cloud 9' moment with an instrument. ================================ I don't know about "Cloud 9" but I've had a few stratospheric experiences:- 1. St Bavo, Haarlem (Muller) 2. St.Lauren's, Alkmaar (F C Schnitger) 3. Blackburn Cathedral (Walker) 4. Martinikerk, Groningen. (Reconstructed Schnitger) 5. Boston USA, Mother Church, Christ Scientist for sheer American "organ power" (Aeolian-Skinner/Phelps) (220+ ranks?) 6. Busch Museum, Harvard, Mass, USA (Flentrop) That's enough pipes for a whole lifetime, I suppose. MM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Goldrick Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 Hereford Cathedral Sydney Town Hall ---------------------- Not in the same league, but I was absolutely smitten with this instrument when I played it last year: St. Brigid's Catholic Church, Red Hill (Queensland) (A near perfect example of how a small specification is transformed by a sympathetic acoustic... and the Trumpet is to die for) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWAnderson Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 My favourites would be: Wellington Town Hall (Norman & Beard 1905)St Matthew's in the City, Auckland (Willis 1862, Lawton & Osborne 1939, Croft 1977)The St Matthew's organ is quite a good organ, and the church has possibly one of the best acoustics in New Zealand. The Tromba 16/8 by Lawton & Osborne is a wonderful stop, but sadly when the organ is being rebuilt, they are not keeping this. Instead it is being replaced by a 'German Baroque Style' Trumpet 16/8/4 (added by Croft 1977), which in my opinion has sort of a squeaky tone which is not very pleasant. JA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJJ Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 Queens College Oxford (the organ version of a cold shower), St Louis en l'Ise (just amazing), Salisbury Cathedral (pure indulgence) Royal Albert Hall (sheer power) and St Anne Limehouse (forget the flues - the big reeds are stunning) - I have yet to play a Cavaille Coll or a Schoenstein (!) - at present the former is more probable than the latter - at least in the near future. AJJ PS Also Stogursey and Kilkhampton (both Roger Yates reworkings of old material) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nachthorn Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 Bill Drake's instrument in St. John's Bridgetown, Totnes, Devon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry Willis Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 My favourites would be:Wellington Town Hall (Norman & Beard 1905)St Matthew's in the City, Auckland (Willis 1862, Lawton & Osborne 1939, Croft 1977)The St Matthew's organ is quite a good organ, and the church has possibly one of the best acoustics in New Zealand. The Tromba 16/8 by Lawton & Osborne is a wonderful stop, but sadly when the organ is being rebuilt, they are not keeping this. Instead it is being replaced by a 'German Baroque Style' Trumpet 16/8/4 (added by Croft 1977), which in my opinion has sort of a squeaky tone which is not very pleasant. JA I think not - where have you taken that rubbish from? There will NOT be any manual extension at all in the new instrument and certainly not any 'German Baroque Style' Trumpet(s) As for the present St. Matthew's instrument being "quite a good organ" - it isn't! The acoustic covers its multitudinous sins - you could scrape a chair across the floor in that building and it would sound good. Only the remains of several original Willis ranks from the existing St. Matthew's organ are being reused for the sake of their history there and the resonators of the (English-made) 8ft part of the reed added by Croft are presently being considered for use as part of the Trompette Militaire on the Solo. I really do deprecate this sort of ridiculous speculation without any basis in fact. http://www.willis-organs.com/auckland_general.html David Wyld. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Harvey Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 I think not - where have you taken that rubbish from? There will NOT be any manual extension at all in the new instrument and certainly not any 'German Baroque Style' Trumpet(s) As for the present St. Matthew's instrument being "quite a good organ" - it isn't! The acoustic covers its multitudinous sins - you could scrape a chair across the floor in that building and it would sound good. Only the remains of several original Willis ranks from the existing St. Matthew's organ are being reused for the sake of their history there and the resonators of the (English-made) 8ft part of the reed added by Croft are presently being considered for use as part of the Trompette Militaire on the Solo. I really do deprecate this sort of ridiculous speculation without any basis in fact. http://www.willis-organs.com/auckland_general.html David Wyld. All best wishes with this exciting project - I hope it comes out well. I'm interested by the spec of the solo organ. It looks a little impoverished on the quieter solo stops but relatively OTT on the loud stuff. It would be nice if the client had had the foresight for a clarinet and some other quieter solo stops and some strings on this division. I find it rather convienent to have the clarinet, etc ready on the solo if the choir organ is doing quiet 8+4 stuff, for example. But I guess it depends on what sort of playing they're doing down under... My Cloud nine organs... Alkmaar - both the Van Hagabeer/Schnitger organ and Choir Organ Oude Kerk, Amsterdam - always hits the spot for me, despite its desperate state. The key action is so satisfying. Reading Town Hall Pembroke College, Cambridge ... and, of course, my own organ at Twyford! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Coram Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 http://www.willis-organs.com/auckland_general.html Scrummy! No Gross Tierce on the pedal? My cloud 9s (in chronological order in terms of when I saw them): New College, Oxford Clifton Cathedral Cookes at Wandsworth and Westbury Drakes at John Loosemore Centre, Buckfastleigh (now at Bristol University) - also Bridgetown as mentioned, Chingford and (possibly above all others) Deptford St Johns Oxford Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry Willis Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 Scrummy! No Gross Tierce on the pedal? A good point - we're hoping that there will be space to include one and if there isn't, I've been considering whether the 10 2/3 would be better replaced by a 6 3/5? Colin's point about the Solo is also a good one: there is no choral tradition at St. Matt's and the present Organist is a fine improviser - I was given the brief to ensure that the organ was best suited for recitals and specifically improvisation - so that's what we decided on. Always the same I suppose, what to leave out and what do you put in - especially when there is a limited budget. DW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pierre Lauwers Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 "we're hoping that there will be space to include one" (Quote about the 6 2/5' Tierce) Maybe by extending the 5 1/3' from the 10 2/3' could some room and pipes be saved ? Pierre Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Coram Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 A good point - we're hoping that there will be space to include one and if there isn't, I've been considering whether the 10 2/3 would be better replaced by a 6 3/5? Colin's point about the Solo is also a good one: there is no choral tradition at St. Matt's and the present Organist is a fine improviser - I was given the brief to ensure that the organ was best suited for recitals and specifically improvisation - so that's what we decided on. Always the same I suppose, what to leave out and what do you put in - especially when there is a limited budget. DW I'd lose the 10 2/3 like a shot. If you've got a harmonics of 32', what's the point in having a quint which will give a relatively indifferent effect anyway? I'd probably be inclined to remove the temptation of bad taste by lumping all the mutations together into one mixture stop. You can still have one or two ranks on their own slider of course, or do a Cooke and provide the facility to select which ranks you want and don't want (in Cooke's one-off case was done to preserve console symmetry rather than anything else). Christchurch Priory's nave division (chorus, big reeds and now a Flute Harmonique) works fine as a Bombarde division - the flues can be transferred to the Gt leaving more or less the same spec as you provide. Then there's the other Christ Church (Oxford) with much the same sort of setup but without the Flute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Bennett Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 My cloud 9 experiences: Hooglandse Kerk, Leiden (de Swart / van Hagerbeer) Grote Kerk, Maassluis (Garrels) Our Lady and the English Martyrs, Cambridge (Abbott & Smith / Nicholson) St Joseph, Ingrow, Keighley (Laycock and Bannister) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pierre Lauwers Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 I'd lose the 10 2/3 like a shot. If you've got a harmonics of 32', what's the point in having a quint which will give a relatively indifferent effect anyway? I'd probably be inclined to remove the temptation of bad taste by lumping all the mutations together into one mixture stop. You can still have one or two ranks on their own slider of course, or do a Cooke and provide the facility to select which ranks you want and don't want (in Cooke's one-off case was done to preserve console symmetry rather than anything else). Christchurch Priory's nave division (chorus, big reeds and now a Flute Harmonique) works fine as a Bombarde division - the flues can be transferred to the Gt leaving more or less the same spec as you provide. Then there's the other Christ Church (Oxford) with much the same sort of setup but without the Flute. A matter of taste, precisely.... E-F Walcker would not have left out his 5 1/3' and 3 1/5' on the Great, and 10 2/3' and 6 2/5' on the Pedal -besides others mutation stops-. We would need to know if there are already borrowings on that Pedal, in order to get a clear vision of what is actually to come on the soundboards. Some extension and borrowing (from the manual 16' stops, the O.D. II...) could help in such a scheme. But maybe it's already planned so. (I mean for the Pedal only, of course). Pierre Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pwhodges Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 Reading Town Hall That's my first. I hired the Town Hall to try it; I still have the receipt saying "Hire of Town Hall: 2/6". The Queen's College, Oxford is my other. As I am only an occasional player I haven't got to play the instruments that I dream about from listening, so my list has to end there. Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazman Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 As already mentioned by others:- Blackburn Cathedral St. John's, Bridgetown, Totnes During my teenage years I was very lucky to have regular practise on the latter. It is heavenly! My understanding is that it's all happy-clappy there nowadays and they've considered disposing of the organ more than once..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Coram Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 Some extension and borrowing (from the manual 16' stops, the O.D. II...) couldhelp in such a scheme. But maybe it's already planned so. (I mean for the Pedal only, of course). Pierre DW has already said there is no extension in the scheme so I presumed that the pedals were included in that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazman Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 Manual extension was the phrase used, I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vox Humana Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 Oh well, here goes: Grossmünster, Zürich (only on LP, alas) The Queen's College, Oxford St Mary's Priory, Fulham Clifton Cathedral, Bristol Washington Cathedral Aachen Cathedral Spot the odd one out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWAnderson Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 I think not - where have you taken that rubbish from? There will NOT be any manual extension at all in the new instrument and certainly not any 'German Baroque Style' Trumpet(s) As for the present St. Matthew's instrument being "quite a good organ" - it isn't! The acoustic covers its multitudinous sins - you could scrape a chair across the floor in that building and it would sound good. Only the remains of several original Willis ranks from the existing St. Matthew's organ are being reused for the sake of their history there and the resonators of the (English-made) 8ft part of the reed added by Croft are presently being considered for use as part of the Trompette Militaire on the Solo. I really do deprecate this sort of ridiculous speculation without any basis in fact. http://www.willis-organs.com/auckland_general.html David Wyld. Sorry David, I have obviously got my facts wrong. There are faults with this organ, particularly the off-note chests in the Pedal & Great (edit), but aside from that I quite like the sound of it. One question: Is the whole rebuilt organ going into the triforium chamber or just parts of it? I was up there in January and had a look at the space, and it does not look very big. JA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pierre Lauwers Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 "Spot the odd one out!" "Washington Cathedral" (Quote) It seems there might be somes W's to be regretted, looking at us from heaven ! (As we say here: je dis ça, je ne dis rien...) Pierre Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pwhodges Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 Grossmünster, Zürich (only on LP, alas) Well, if LPs are admitted, then I'll have this one too (Rogg playing Hindemith, rather than his Bach). Truly wonderful sounds! Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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