Jump to content
Mander Organ Builders Forum

Seventh Heaven - I've Arrived - Have You?


Guest Hector5
 Share

Recommended Posts

Guest Hector5

Today I finally reached what must be my own personal seventh heaven, having finally played the Mutin Cavaille Coll at Meursault, through the kindness of their organist. Contrary to my previous posts about the organ, the updated stoplist is:

 

 

MANUAL

16 Bourdon

8 Diapason Bass

8 Diapason Dessus

8 Flute Harmonique

8 Salicional

4 Prestant

IV Plein Jeu

16 Tuba Magna Bass

16 Tuba Magna Dessus

8 Trompette

4 Soprano (actually a Clairon)

 

PEDALE

16 Soubasse

 

PEDALS

Soubasse

Appe Anches

Tir. Manual

 

My goodness, what an organ! Leaving the reeds aside, this is an organ with real presence and seems to effortlessl accompany a full congregation singing (yes - even French sing in Meursault!) on just the principals 8 and 4. The reeds are absolutely terrifying at the console. The whole instrument is only as deep as the diminuative console, with two sets of well shutters, one set on the front of the case, the other set opening at the back and firing off the west wall.

 

On my drive into Meursault this morning, I listened to a French mass on the radio which seemed to have a two manual spit and squawk attempting to accompany, and very badly. Dynamics were achieved by the addition of pitches rather than colors. In short, it was awful - until I stepped into Meursault church, were I was wrapped in the warm embrace this fabulous organ. I tried everything I could throw at it, and it coped beautifully. Only double manual stuff (tricky stuff) really had to be left at the bottom of the stairs. Otherwise you simply cannot fault this organ. Oh, the console action adn pedalboard was sooooooooooooo comfortable.

 

I've been on cloud 9 ever since my visit, and can't wait to get back there.

 

Putting size aside - has anyone else experienced a 'cloud 9' moment with an instrument.

 

Best wishes from sunny Burgundy.

 

Hector

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest Barry Williams

"Putting size aside - has anyone else experienced a 'cloud 9' moment with an instrument."

 

In no particular order:

 

1. Liverpool Cathedral

 

2. St Philip's Cosham

 

3. St Michael's Abbey Farnborough

 

Barry Williams

Link to comment
Share on other sites

[quote

 

Has anyone else experienced a 'cloud 9' moment with an instrument?

/quote]

 

 

 

Oh yes....! In no particular order:

 

Blenheim Palace - Father Willis

 

Abbatiale Sainte Croix, Bordeaux - Dom Bedos, restored Pascal Quoirin

 

Westerkerk, Amsterdam - Duyschot 1686 rebuilt Vater etc.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest spottedmetal
Has anyone else experienced a 'cloud 9' moment with an instrument?

Yes! You might have seen the Venice thread. WOW! That instrument in a beautiful classical building with a reverb exceeding 7 seconds - an instrument with a single manual, diminished pedalboard, thin case and probably 20 diminishing stops (haven't counted) - yes could have played all day . . . and possibly be satisfied for life . . . . possibly even worth becoming a monk for . . . . !

 

Is the cloud 9 moment simply a novelty unexpected refreshment to our ears? Can it be permanent? Or does it give us inspiration to hear, listen and play other instruments with new ears?

 

Best wishes

 

Spot

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Putting size aside - has anyone else experienced a 'cloud 9' moment with an instrument.

 

 

================================

 

I don't know about "Cloud 9" but I've had a few stratospheric experiences:-

 

 

1. St Bavo, Haarlem (Muller)

 

2. St.Lauren's, Alkmaar (F C Schnitger)

 

3. Blackburn Cathedral (Walker)

 

4. Martinikerk, Groningen. (Reconstructed Schnitger)

 

5. Boston USA, Mother Church, Christ Scientist for sheer American "organ power" (Aeolian-Skinner/Phelps) (220+ ranks?)

 

6. Busch Museum, Harvard, Mass, USA (Flentrop)

 

That's enough pipes for a whole lifetime, I suppose.

 

MM

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hereford Cathedral

 

Sydney Town Hall

 

----------------------

Not in the same league, but I was absolutely smitten with this instrument when I played it last year:

St. Brigid's Catholic Church, Red Hill (Queensland)

(A near perfect example of how a small specification is transformed by a sympathetic acoustic... and the Trumpet is to die for)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

My favourites would be:

  • Wellington Town Hall (Norman & Beard 1905)
St Matthew's in the City, Auckland (Willis 1862, Lawton & Osborne 1939, Croft 1977)

The St Matthew's organ is quite a good organ, and the church has possibly one of the best acoustics in New Zealand.

The Tromba 16/8 by Lawton & Osborne is a wonderful stop, but sadly when the organ is being rebuilt, they are not keeping this.

Instead it is being replaced by a 'German Baroque Style' Trumpet 16/8/4 (added by Croft 1977), which in my opinion has sort of a squeaky tone which is not very pleasant.

 

JA

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Queens College Oxford (the organ version of a cold shower), St Louis en l'Ise (just amazing), Salisbury Cathedral (pure indulgence) Royal Albert Hall (sheer power) and St Anne Limehouse (forget the flues - the big reeds are stunning) - I have yet to play a Cavaille Coll or a Schoenstein (!) - at present the former is more probable than the latter - at least in the near future.

 

AJJ

 

PS Also Stogursey and Kilkhampton (both Roger Yates reworkings of old material)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

My favourites would be:
  • Wellington Town Hall (Norman & Beard 1905)
St Matthew's in the City, Auckland (Willis 1862, Lawton & Osborne 1939, Croft 1977)

The St Matthew's organ is quite a good organ, and the church has possibly one of the best acoustics in New Zealand.

The Tromba 16/8 by Lawton & Osborne is a wonderful stop, but sadly when the organ is being rebuilt, they are not keeping this.

Instead it is being replaced by a 'German Baroque Style' Trumpet 16/8/4 (added by Croft 1977), which in my opinion has sort of a squeaky tone which is not very pleasant.

 

JA

 

I think not - where have you taken that rubbish from? There will NOT be any manual extension at all in the new instrument and certainly not any 'German Baroque Style' Trumpet(s)

 

As for the present St. Matthew's instrument being "quite a good organ" - it isn't! The acoustic covers its multitudinous sins - you could scrape a chair across the floor in that building and it would sound good.

 

Only the remains of several original Willis ranks from the existing St. Matthew's organ are being reused for the sake of their history there and the resonators of the (English-made) 8ft part of the reed added by Croft are presently being considered for use as part of the Trompette Militaire on the Solo.

 

I really do deprecate this sort of ridiculous speculation without any basis in fact.

 

http://www.willis-organs.com/auckland_general.html

 

David Wyld.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think not - where have you taken that rubbish from? There will NOT be any manual extension at all in the new instrument and certainly not any 'German Baroque Style' Trumpet(s)

 

As for the present St. Matthew's instrument being "quite a good organ" - it isn't! The acoustic covers its multitudinous sins - you could scrape a chair across the floor in that building and it would sound good.

 

Only the remains of several original Willis ranks from the existing St. Matthew's organ are being reused for the sake of their history there and the resonators of the (English-made) 8ft part of the reed added by Croft are presently being considered for use as part of the Trompette Militaire on the Solo.

 

I really do deprecate this sort of ridiculous speculation without any basis in fact.

 

http://www.willis-organs.com/auckland_general.html

 

David Wyld.

 

All best wishes with this exciting project - I hope it comes out well.

 

I'm interested by the spec of the solo organ. It looks a little impoverished on the quieter solo stops but relatively OTT on the loud stuff. It would be nice if the client had had the foresight for a clarinet and some other quieter solo stops and some strings on this division. I find it rather convienent to have the clarinet, etc ready on the solo if the choir organ is doing quiet 8+4 stuff, for example. But I guess it depends on what sort of playing they're doing down under...

 

My Cloud nine organs...

 

Alkmaar - both the Van Hagabeer/Schnitger organ and Choir Organ

Oude Kerk, Amsterdam - always hits the spot for me, despite its desperate state. The key action is so satisfying.

Reading Town Hall

Pembroke College, Cambridge

... and, of course, my own organ at Twyford!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

Scrummy! No Gross Tierce on the pedal?

 

My cloud 9s (in chronological order in terms of when I saw them):

 

New College, Oxford

 

Clifton Cathedral

 

Cookes at Wandsworth and Westbury

 

Drakes at John Loosemore Centre, Buckfastleigh (now at Bristol University) - also Bridgetown as mentioned, Chingford and (possibly above all others) Deptford

 

St Johns Oxford

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Scrummy! No Gross Tierce on the pedal?

 

A good point - we're hoping that there will be space to include one and if there isn't, I've been considering whether the 10 2/3 would be better replaced by a 6 3/5?

 

Colin's point about the Solo is also a good one: there is no choral tradition at St. Matt's and the present Organist is a fine improviser - I was given the brief to ensure that the organ was best suited for recitals and specifically improvisation - so that's what we decided on.

 

Always the same I suppose, what to leave out and what do you put in - especially when there is a limited budget.

 

DW

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A good point - we're hoping that there will be space to include one and if there isn't, I've been considering whether the 10 2/3 would be better replaced by a 6 3/5?

 

Colin's point about the Solo is also a good one: there is no choral tradition at St. Matt's and the present Organist is a fine improviser - I was given the brief to ensure that the organ was best suited for recitals and specifically improvisation - so that's what we decided on.

 

Always the same I suppose, what to leave out and what do you put in - especially when there is a limited budget.

 

DW

 

I'd lose the 10 2/3 like a shot. If you've got a harmonics of 32', what's the point in having a quint which will give a relatively indifferent effect anyway? I'd probably be inclined to remove the temptation of bad taste by lumping all the mutations together into one mixture stop. You can still have one or two ranks on their own slider of course, or do a Cooke and provide the facility to select which ranks you want and don't want (in Cooke's one-off case was done to preserve console symmetry rather than anything else).

 

Christchurch Priory's nave division (chorus, big reeds and now a Flute Harmonique) works fine as a Bombarde division - the flues can be transferred to the Gt leaving more or less the same spec as you provide. Then there's the other Christ Church (Oxford) with much the same sort of setup but without the Flute.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'd lose the 10 2/3 like a shot. If you've got a harmonics of 32', what's the point in having a quint which will give a relatively indifferent effect anyway? I'd probably be inclined to remove the temptation of bad taste by lumping all the mutations together into one mixture stop. You can still have one or two ranks on their own slider of course, or do a Cooke and provide the facility to select which ranks you want and don't want (in Cooke's one-off case was done to preserve console symmetry rather than anything else).

 

Christchurch Priory's nave division (chorus, big reeds and now a Flute Harmonique) works fine as a Bombarde division - the flues can be transferred to the Gt leaving more or less the same spec as you provide. Then there's the other Christ Church (Oxford) with much the same sort of setup but without the Flute.

 

A matter of taste, precisely....

E-F Walcker would not have left out his 5 1/3' and 3 1/5'

on the Great, and 10 2/3' and 6 2/5' on the Pedal -besides others

mutation stops-.

We would need to know if there are already borrowings

on that Pedal, in order to get a clear vision of what is

actually to come on the soundboards.

Some extension and borrowing (from the manual 16' stops, the O.D. II...) could

help in such a scheme. But maybe it's already planned so.

(I mean for the Pedal only, of course).

Pierre

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Reading Town Hall

:blink: That's my first. I hired the Town Hall to try it; I still have the receipt saying "Hire of Town Hall: 2/6".

 

The Queen's College, Oxford is my other.

 

As I am only an occasional player I haven't got to play the instruments that I dream about from listening, so my list has to end there.

 

Paul

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As already mentioned by others:-

 

Blackburn Cathedral

St. John's, Bridgetown, Totnes

 

During my teenage years I was very lucky to have regular practise on the latter. It is heavenly! My understanding is that it's all happy-clappy there nowadays and they've considered disposing of the organ more than once..... :blink:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Some extension and borrowing (from the manual 16' stops, the O.D. II...) could

help in such a scheme. But maybe it's already planned so.

(I mean for the Pedal only, of course).

Pierre

 

DW has already said there is no extension in the scheme so I presumed that the pedals were included in that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think not - where have you taken that rubbish from? There will NOT be any manual extension at all in the new instrument and certainly not any 'German Baroque Style' Trumpet(s)

 

As for the present St. Matthew's instrument being "quite a good organ" - it isn't! The acoustic covers its multitudinous sins - you could scrape a chair across the floor in that building and it would sound good.

 

Only the remains of several original Willis ranks from the existing St. Matthew's organ are being reused for the sake of their history there and the resonators of the (English-made) 8ft part of the reed added by Croft are presently being considered for use as part of the Trompette Militaire on the Solo.

 

I really do deprecate this sort of ridiculous speculation without any basis in fact.

 

http://www.willis-organs.com/auckland_general.html

 

David Wyld.

 

Sorry David, I have obviously got my facts wrong.

 

There are faults with this organ, particularly the off-note chests in the Pedal & Great (edit), but aside from that I quite like the sound of it.

 

One question: Is the whole rebuilt organ going into the triforium chamber or just parts of it?

I was up there in January and had a look at the space, and it does not look very big.

 

JA

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Please sign in to comment

You will be able to leave a comment after signing in



Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...