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Le Nouvel Orgue De La Cathédrale De Monaco

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Le Lauréat du concours pour la restauration-reconstruction du grand-orgue de la Cathédrale de Monaco vient d'être proclamé. Il s'agit de la manufacture d'orgues THOMAS (Belgique).

Découvrez son magnifique projet ici :

 

http://www.olivier-vernet.com/festivals-vernet.php

 

L'orgue actuel ne sera démonté qu'au dernier moment, tout le travail préparatoire ayant été effectué en atelier en amont. Le nouvel instrument résonnera pour la Fête Nationale (29 novembre) 2010.

 

Voilà un instrument qui sans nul doute fera parler de lui bien au delà des frontières.

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Le Lauréat du concours pour la restauration-reconstruction du grand-orgue de la Cathédrale de Monaco vient d'être proclamé. Il s'agit de la manufacture d'orgues THOMAS (Belgique).

Découvrez son magnifique projet ici :

 

http://www.olivier-vernet.com/festivals-vernet.php

 

L'orgue actuel ne sera démonté qu'au dernier moment, tout le travail préparatoire ayant été effectué en atelier en amont. Le nouvel instrument résonnera pour la Fête Nationale (29 novembre) 2010.

 

Voilà un instrument qui sans nul doute fera parler de lui bien au delà des frontières.

Salut, Olivier et merci pour ton message a fait avec le nouvel orgue de la cathedrale de Monaco. Je pense que la conception de cet orgue est un peu bizarre, n'est pas?

 

Un question: pourquoi est-ce-que les claviers I - III ont 56 notes et la IVeme clavier ont seule 39 notes?

 

(Je m'excuse si ma Français ici est pas bon: je suis naturellement Anglais! :lol:)

 

Dave

 

Translation:

Hi Oliver, and thanks for your message to do with the new organ in Monaco cathedral. I think that the design of this organ is a bit bizarre, isn't it.

A question: why do manuals I - III have 56 notes and the 4th manual only have 39 notes?

 

(Excuse me if my French is not very good: I am English.)

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Guest Nigel ALLCOAT
A question: why do manuals I - III have 56 notes and the 4th manual only have 39 notes?

 

Perhaps I can quickly answer? It is a manual that is Dessus - meaning higher/upper/on top Solo for the right hand and therefore needs no pipes for anything played with the left hand. It is a modern variation of the old French Récit departments which are Solo manuals and normally start at middle C. At a guess, this manual will start at Tenor G. Considering the traditions of France I do not find this at all bizarre. And come to think of it - most players with a UK Solo 4th manual department mostly only use a right hand on it. Of course, exceptions, but as a Solo/Récit division it is perfectly understandable and certainly one way of making a budget stretch further.

 

Best wishes.

Nigel

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This all looks quite exciting - I heard the current manifestation of the organ some years ago and while very much of its time had a rather gritty sound to it - all rather bottled up at the west end too. It looks as if they are reconstructing and giving the whole thing more of a 'purpose'. The new casework with lighting effects will be impressive too. (Incidentally - while checking the French via Google translate - it was interesting to see a stop on the Recit. called Heavenly Voices 8 - I could do with one of those sometimes - my French is ok but all the same... )

 

AJJ

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The Boisseau organ is very interesting, while Mr Thomas, the best belgian organ-builder today,

will, no doubt, make it even more interesting.

Thomas builds after several styles. He can even build credible Bach organs !

(Example: the organ of the Temple du Bouclier, Strasbourg).

He also rebuilt the Le Picard organ of Tongeren (Limburg, Belgium) to its original,

Liège 18th century style, state.

As this style is close to the late 17th century french one, I know of no organ as well suited

for Nicolas de Grigny...

 

In short: the Monaco file is to be followed closely, there will be a gem there.

 

Best wishes,

Pierre

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The Boisseau organ is very interesting, while Mr Thomas, the best belgian organ-builder today,

will, no doubt, make it even more interesting.

Thomas builds after several styles. He can even build credible Bach organs !

(Example: the organ of the Temple du Bouclier, Strasbourg).

He also rebuilt the Le Picard organ of Tongeren (Limburg, Belgium) to its original,

Liège 18th century style, state.

As this style is close to the late 17th century french one, I know of no organ as well suited

for Nicolas de Grigny...

 

In short: the Monaco file is to be followed closely, there will be a gem there.

 

Best wishes,

Pierre

 

I was interested in what you might say Pierre - the sort of work suggested at Monaco could either be very effective - or not. This then sounds a very positive reworking of the instrument.

 

AJJ

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The former builder -Boisseau- will act as adviser in this rebuild !

This illustrates the huge difference with the usual "I can do better"

attitude so widely spread in the past -the past ? :lol: -

 

Mr Thomas is a modern, enlightened builder. Like Mr Mander at St-Paul

(see the thread), prudent, carefull, and conscious that "beauty" is a subjective

notion that continuously, and quickly, evolves. Reversibility and respect for

what exists are the keys to any success.

 

Pierre

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The former builder -Boisseau- will act as adviser in this rebuild !

This illustrates the huge difference with the usual "I can do better"

attitude so widely spread in the past -the past ? :lol: -

 

Mr Thomas is a modern, enlightened builder. Like Mr Mander at St-Paul

(see the thread), prudent, carefull, and conscious that "beauty" is a subjective

notion that continuously, and quickly, evolves. Reversibility and respect for

what exists are the keys to any success.

 

Pierre

 

Better and better! - does the Thomas company have a website? - I can't find one as yet.

 

AJJ

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Guest Hector5

Curiously the name of Thomas came up here in France this week at Meursault. The kind organist had the organ tuned for me, and it was done by Dominique Thomas of the same company. Sitting on the organ stool was a small pile of brochures and CDs as a gift. One CD was of the excellent organ at Notre Dame du Finistere, Bruxelles and the other of the Eglises Reformee du Bouclier, Strasbourg. One represents a restoration, the other a new organ. I'm always somewhat glum when presented with Silbermann copies or the like - but this one is an 11/10 on a wow scale. It has superb choruses, and also rich silky sounding foundations (4 x 8' on each manual) - with Principals, Flutes and Strings in equal measure. The CD is produced my Saluste Records and I can heartily recommend it. The restored Brussels organ (on CD Sic 006) is organ is arresting in it's own way and a wonderful sound- the CD being a gem for the organ and also for the repertoire as well.

 

 

 

I shall make an effort to hear more of this company's work!!!

 

 

Hector

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The Temple du bouclier organ is not the next "Silbermann copy", it is inspired by the

central german style of the 18th century, also Trost, Wender et al. as well.

This is no more a "neo-baroque" organ !

 

The Finistère church organ was built by Hyppolite Loret, the founder of the belgian

romantic tradition; Loret had the Schlimbach treatise as his "Bible".

This 1795 text was based on the Joachim Wagner tradition in the Berlin-Brandenburg area.

This is the reason why, at the Finistère organ, you find things like this "Flûte pyramidale",

a Spitzflöte, Complete Cornets (through the complete compass) which are not placed higher

but on the soundboard, etc.

 

The organ was electrified by Delmotte; Thomas brought it completely back to its original

state, save some modifications, like the 4' Voix céleste that had been changed to 8', which

were done by Loret's brother, and approved by him.

 

So we have now here one of the gems in Brussels.

If you get the chance to go there, take Mendelssohn's music with you...

 

Pierre

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Perhaps I can quickly answer? It is a manual that is Dessus - meaning higher/upper/on top Solo for the right hand and therefore needs no pipes for anything played with the left hand. It is a modern variation of the old French Récit departments which are Solo manuals and normally start at middle C. At a guess, this manual will start at Tenor G. Considering the traditions of France I do not find this at all bizarre. And come to think of it - most players with a UK Solo 4th manual department mostly only use a right hand on it. Of course, exceptions, but as a Solo/Récit division it is perfectly understandable and certainly one way of making a budget stretch further.

 

Best wishes.

Nigel

 

Indeed, it's not only a French trait:

 

http://npor.emma.cam.ac.uk/cgi-bin/Rsearch...ec_index=N14450

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During my regular "inspection" of organ builders' webpages I've found a detailed description of the new organ for Monaco Cathedral on the homepage of Manufacture d'orgues Thomas. Some googling afterwards brought about this interesting piece of information:

 

The new organ was presented to the public on March 5 and it will be transported to Monaco by the end of this month. The assembly is supposed to take two months and voicing of the instrument is to be finished in mid November, just in time for the Fête Nationale. The organ with 74 stops has nearly 7000 pipes (2/3 of which are still from the old Merklin instrument), is 12 m high and weighs 20 tons (with the supporting metal structure alone weighing 7 tons). Organ blessing/dedication is to take place on December 8 2011, whereas the official opening is planned for spring 2012.

 

orgues.jpg

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I'm not sure whether the new Thomas organ in the Monaco Cathedral is something the members of this forum are interested in - I personally find the instrument to be one of the most exciting examples of modern organ design, which is why I would like to draw your attention to the construction progress of this instrument and direct you to the following set of photos:

 

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=8140...53&v=photos

 

It's a pity the organ couldn't be used at the recent wedding (if it was me, I'd most certainly postpone the event ;)) . It would obviously make a somewhat different impression compared to the digital substitute that was used.

 

M

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The organ with 74 stops has nearly 7000 pipes (2/3 of which are still from the old Merklin instrument), is 12 m high and weighs 20 tons (with the supporting metal structure alone weighing 7 tons). Organ blessing/dedication is to take place on December 8 2011, whereas the official opening is planned for spring 2012.

 

That is a lot of pipes for 74 stops, if you work it out. We have 92 stops and about 5 1/2 thousand pipes. Why?

 

B

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That is a lot of pipes for 74 stops, if you work it out. We have 92 stops and about 5 1/2 thousand pipes. Why?

Is it "Why?" or "How?" ;)

 

The stoplist, when counted the usual way, gives about 4700 pipes (manual ranks * 61 except the Dessus, which I counted with 37 keys, c' to c''''; pedal ranks * 32), give and take some (can't figure out the 3 to 5 ranks mixture in the Récit); or rather give some, since the trebles of the reeds most probably contain several ranks of flue pipes, so that we shall easily arrive at about 5000 pipes, or just below.

 

If there are more, then there must be multiple-rank foundations somewhere (perhaps in the diapason choruses and/or display pipes), and/or helpers in the doubles (height is limited, I understand), or something else I can't think of which makes the pipe count go up. Or it's just boasting. (Or my maths are foul, which is well possible.)

 

Best,

Friedrich

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That is a lot of pipes for 74 stops, if you work it out. We have 92 stops and about 5 1/2 thousand pipes. Why?

 

B

 

You've obviously got a point here. When I was Googling for some info regarding the new organ for Monaco Cathedral, I found a couple of texts, which all seemed to be based on some sort of press release from the beginning of March 2011. One of the sentences there was: "L'instrument disposera de 74 jeux et a été confectionné avec près de 7.000 tuyaux, dont la plupart sont issus de l'ancien orgue de la Cathédrale de Monaco." Since my French is very basic level, I concluded that the new organ must have some 7000 pipes, without actually considering that this is virtually impossible. As Sprondel calculated, there would be less than 5000 pipes altogether. Or does someone have any other information (calculation)?

 

M

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You've obviously got a point here. When I was Googling for some info regarding the new organ for Monaco Cathedral, I found a couple of texts, which all seemed to be based on some sort of press release from the beginning of March 2011. One of the sentences there was: "L'instrument disposera de 74 jeux et a été confectionné avec près de 7.000 tuyaux, dont la plupart sont issus de l'ancien orgue de la Cathédrale de Monaco." Since my French is very basic level, I concluded that the new organ must have some 7000 pipes, without actually considering that this is virtually impossible. As Sprondel calculated, there would be less than 5000 pipes altogether. Or does someone have any other information (calculation)?

 

M

 

My French is probably worse than yours, but that does indeed seem to be what it says. On a neo-baroque organ with dozens of many-ranked mixtures, it would be far from implausible, but here?

 

On the other hand, often even the organ builders have no idea how many pipes are really in the organ. They just make them one at a time, and then have to go and count them.

 

B

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I wonder if it's a typo? I calculate about 5,500 pipes (give or take 100-200) in this organ. I'd be surprised if there's (m)any doubled ranks - it's not really in the style of this French Classical/Romantic concept. We're not talking a copy of the organ in the Nieuwekerk in Amsterdam!

 

I saw the new Thomas organ in Vianen a couple of weeks ago: http://www.orgues-thomas.com/website/index...=89&lang=en. There should be an article about it sometime in Choir and Organ.

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