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Posts posted by Florian

  1. A long time ago I was sitting, prior to Evensong, in a Cathedral church in the North. A lady came up to me and said "Excuse me, but that's my seat". I looked at her, slightly astonished, and she added "I'm Mrs ...................." (the wife of the Master of the Choristers)


    That's what happened once at a Three Choirs Festival prior to a performance of Louis Spohr's Last Judgement. A lady was asked to move to another seat and replied: "This is my seat. I was sitting here for the Creation and I intend to remain in this seat for the Last Judgement."


  2. I should have added to the above that Jerome's knowledge of Hebrew is irrelevant when translating Greek texts. :lol:


    He himself called his translation 'iuxta Hebraeos' (from the Hebrew).

    According to many historians his prime source was in fact a Hebrew edition in Greek letters (a so called 'hexaplaric Septuaginta').

  3. My old edition of the Vulgate bible (undated, but it was old when I picked it up c.1970) reads Petrus, as does the Vatican's own online Vugate here (Matthew 16:18): http://www.vatican.va/archive/bible/nova_v...aeum_lt.html#16. Our traditional English reading, "Thou art Peter", must also have derived from a version that read "Petrus". That said, I know the Vulgate has not gone unchanged over the centuries.


    As for the Vetus Latina, didn't that give way to Jerome's Vulgate (except those parts of the bible he didn't deal with) in the fifth century? I might be quite wrong here though.


    Be careful: there are different Vulgatas. The one quotet above is the Nova Vulgata, a critical edition made in 1979. The current English edition of the Vulgata dates from 1889.

    'Petra' is to be found in mediaeval editions of the Vulgata (8th and 9th Century).

    As with many details of the old Vulgata (Hieronymus knew only a little bit Hebrew) 'Petra' could probably be an error.

  4. 'Petra' is simply the version of the Vulgate.


    But what is even more interesting is the fact that Mulet omitts a part of the original text: Tu es Petrus et super hanc Petram aedificabo Ecclesiam meam et portae inferi non praevalebunt adversus eam.

  5. Dave, you are just so trendy, that your sign-off HTIOI has not even appeared there yet. Please enlighten us. Maybe it's something useful or deeply significant...


    HTIOI = Hope this is of interest <_<

  6. My (German) source points out that the only specification we have of this instrument dates from 1739 (which means years after Bach left Weimar!).


    Some further corrections (in bold type):




    Gross-Untersatz 32

    Sub-Bass 16

    Violon-Bass 16

    Principal-Bass 8

    Posaun-Bass 16

    Trompetten-Bass 8

    Cornett-Bass 4




    'Upper manual' (Hauptwerk)


    Quintathön 16

    Principal 8

    Gemshorn 8

    Gedackt 8

    Octava 4

    Quintathön 4

    Mixtur VI

    Cymbel III



    'Lower Manual' (Internal Positiv)


    Principal 8

    Viol di Gamba 8

    Gedackt 8

    Octava 4

    Klein Gedackt 4

    Waldflöt 2

    Sesquialtera II or 4

    Trompete 8


    Tremulant eventually for the entire instrument



    According to the book, "The organ was situated in the highest gallery of this very tall chapel. The entire castle was burned down in 1774."

  7. Dear folks


    Was wondering if anyone could point me in the right direction on order to find some original scores of the organ workd by A. Guilmant?


    Jon Thorne


    There is an 'Urtext' edition of the 8 Sonatas and some smaller pieces, published at Baerenreiter, which can be recommended. Unfortunately, the beautiful Leupold edition of the complete organ works seems to be out of print.

  8. The version of the story I heard was that it was Benjamin Britten who, once a year, would solemnly play a recording of a piece of Brahms to remind himself 'just what a talentless bastard he was'.


    For the same reason I play once a year a recording of Britten's 'Prelude and Fugue on a theme of Vittoria'... :)

  9. Another CD which I don't think has yet been mentioned is of the Symphonie-Choral op.69, Symphonie Sacree op 71, Fresque Symphonie Sacree nos.1 and 2, op 75 and 76. Recorded by Delvallee at St Sernin, an old(ish) recording of 1989 probably no longer available, but superb.


    This marvellous recording is still available. Have a look here... Tournemire Symphonies

  10. But what he didn't suggest is the obvious idea (once one has made the connection to astronomical clocks) that the four sections correspond to the phases of the moon, as I suggest below!


    First: New moon d min :mellow:

    Second: Waxing first quarter F maj :rolleyes:

    Third: Full Moon a min :lol:

    Forth: Waning third quarter d min :(


    Piet Kee wrote a very comprehensive article about numerical symbolism and the lunar phases in the d minor Passacaglia in 1984.

  11. I have particularly enjoyed listening to the improvisation on Victimae Paschali, but bear in mind that when Duruflé transcribed it, he made some important changes to tighten up the structure of the piece. (I want to be able to cite a source for this, but I can't remember where I read it now - sorry!)


    There is no need for a written source: just compare the original recording of Tournemire's improvisation (EMI) with the printed text of the Duruflé-transcription. :rolleyes:

  12. After discussing Elgar's Imperial March I would like to point out an alternative reading in the same composer's Chanson de Matin.


    On the last page of the Brewer arrangement, 8th bar (one bar before the fermata on the high E):


    - Elgar's orchestral version and Brewer's organ transcription have a quaver G followed by 6 semiquavers B C# E F# G B

    - Elgar's version for violin and piano and Thomson's piano solo arrangement have 8 semiquavers G B C# E G H C# E and the high E an octave higher. This lovely version could easily be produced on the organ with a 4ft flute instead of Brewer's 'Choir soft 8ft' and playing an octave lower.

  13. Having just listened to at least four different orchestral samples - courtesy of iTunes, there appears to be a misprint in the Martin transcription published by Novello: bar 27 (two bars before the modulation from B flat to E flat) - the pedal minim (beats 1 and 2) should be bottom C - not E flat as printed.


    I think you're right: it should be bottom C instead of E flat. I own two different orchestral recordings (one rather dull by Groves, and the highly inspired Boult recording), and in both cases it is not easy to distinguish whether they play C or E flat, because the bass drum covers most of the lower notes. For absolute security you have to refer to a full score.


    In my opinion there seems to be another misprint: the left hand rhythm in the trio section (E flat major, poco meno mosso), in the orchestral version played by the bassoons, appears in the wrong order: right at the beginning of the Trio comes the the rhythm which Martin gives on page 4 (last bar of 3rd system), and vice versa.

  14. My question is, what to do about registering the two fanfare sections: The written registration is Swell 8' reeds on the first fanfare and then Tuba (or Gt. Reed) on the second.


    I have two recordings: Malcolm Archer at Wells who does Swell reeds first and then that colossal Tuba on the second fanfare: and my teacher Peter Kneeshaw's on the Letourneau at St Mary's Cathedral which has the brightest Tuba I've ever come across. He uses the Tuba for both fanfares and for the final flourish of arpeggios, which I think is much more exciting than the written registration. However I find both options convincing.


    Any thoughts?


    I play it as written by Fletcher: Swell reeds for the first and Tuba for the second fanfare.

    As I play this piece usually on German organs I often have to make use of Fletcher's alternative registration for the second fanfare (Great reeds), which works well either.

    By the way: as many modern Choir manuals sound too neobaroque to my ears I play the places in question in the middle section on the Swell (8, 4, 2), alternating with the Great.

  15. On the topic of odd couplers, The organ in the Paul Recital Hall at Juilliard in New York has a Pedal to Great coupler.


    I wonder if anyone has ever used it?


    As far as I am informed a Pedal to Great coupler exists in Notre-Dame de Paris as well.

  16. 7 Pieces in E flat

    No 4: in the antepenultimate bar the left hand reads C Bb G. This can't be right, but should it be C Ab F or C Bb Ab?

    > Kalmus has C Bb Ab.


    7 Pieces in E

    No 5: The left-hand registration begins with stop #1 (Cor anglais). At bar 36 there is an instruction to subtract sto #$ (Basson 8'), but where do you add it?

    > Kalmus has the sign to add stop #4 in bar 21.


    7 Pieces in F

    Sortie: On the first beat of the left hand in bar 70 should there be a quaver C above the A (as in bar 21)?

    > Kalmus has no C. In my opinion this is an error in the first edition and I play bar 70 like bar 21.


    7 Pieces in F#

    No 5: The first left-hand note of bar 17 is B. Surely this should be an A?

    > Kalmus has A.


    7 Pieces in G

    No 2: At bar 16 there is an instruction in the left hand to add stop #4. This is repeated at bar 26. Presumably the latter should be slashed?

    > This error occurs also in the Kalmus edition. I agree with you that it should be slashed.


    Be aware of the Kaunzinger edition of the Franck organ works. There are numerous editorial decisions which have nothing to do with an Urtext edition. The most reliable editions are the reprints of the original French editions and I clearly prefer the Dover edition (which could easily be corrected with Rollin Smith books at your hand) to the Kaunzinger edition, which has also the disadvantage that you have to turn pages every second bar ;-)

  17. The Kalmus edition is an exact reprint of the original Enoch edition from 1892 which is based on the second of the two authograph scores and which is without any major errors. With the Kaunzinger edition at your hand you can correct some minor errors (missing or doubtful ties), but I have to admit that I clearly prefer the print layout of the Kalmus edition.

    In the excellent preface of the Kalmus edition the different harmonium registrations are discussed so that it's easy to write the actual pitch over the original harmonium registrations.

    In my opinion Franck's use of 4' stops for the bass an 16' stops for the treble is unique in literature for organ AND harmonium. Other pieces from this genre are either conceived in a more "universal" manner with the possibility of a performance on the organ in mind (e.g. Boellmanns "Heures mystiques") or they are composed rather for the organ than for the harmonium but with the possibility to play it without pedals (Viernes "Pièces en style libre" and his two "Messes basses").

    Franck however writes in his "L'Organiste", which contains some of his most beautiful music, more for the harmonium than for the organ and in my opinion a performance on the organ should reflect both the original harmonium registrations and the typical colours of the Franck organ.


    I give you here my registrations in french terms for the awesome "Offertoire funèbre" in f# minor:



    Récit: Fonds 8' (Flute, Gambe, Bourdon)

    Positif: Fonds doux 8'

    Grand-Orgue: Fonds doux 8'

    Pédale: 16'+8'

    GO and P coupled, box closed


    bar 1: right hand R ne octave lower, left hand GP one octave higher

    bar 5: both hands on R, right hand "loco", left hand one octave higher

    bar 11: as bar 1, box half opened

    bar 15: as bar 5

    bar 21: both hand on GP

    bar 25: + Swell (GPR)

    bar 29: both hands on R (loco)

    bar 34: close the box, on the last c# minus Flute

    bar 35: plus Voix céleste

    the entire section from 35 to 62 is played on R, 35-46 and 55-62 with pedal

    bar 62: minus Voix céleste, plus Flute

    bar 63: both hands on GPR (loco)

    bar 67: both hands on R (loco)

    bar 72: pedal

    bar 73: R minus Flute, plus Voix céleste; right hand on R one octave lower, left hand on PR loco; last chord with pedal


    It's up to you to decide whether this arrangement goes to far or is just in the limits of a "normal" Franck organ work.

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