Buxtehude
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Posts posted by Buxtehude
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Sorry to resurrect this topic, having enjoyed reading various contributions so far. However, I now find myself in the unusual position of being told I HAVE to wear a hood for Sunday services (nearly always Eucharist). I have occasionally worn one in the past, but I resent being told I have to wear one and would appreciate any information regarding church law/conventions etc. that people are willing to share that would possibly aid a constructive communication with the boss!
Many thanks
I have always understood that hoods may be worn for the office but may not be worn for sacraments (Eucharistic services and, even in this day and age, weddings). I'm not sure where I learnt this though.
Wear a hoodie...make sure one or two talkative members of the congregation know why...
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Karg-Elert now thank we all our God at grade 8? Seems a bit of a simple piece for that level. Surely not comparable to the Bairstow?
I've heard plenty of poor performances of the Karg-Elert which audiences/congregations still seem to enjoy. I think (hope!) examiners will be discerning and not be fobbed off by splashy chords and runs. Plenty of examiners are organists (I believe) and will instinctively weight their expectations in a work such as this.
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I am an elected member of PCC, though were I not I would be co-opted anyway (in the contract...) at least to DCC level (complex structures here).
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Obituary in today's Telegraph:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/obituaries...anley-Vann.html
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As to comparisons between Organ registration and orchestration, a violin sounds very much like another violin.
I've been struggling to avoid reacting to this and find I can't stop myself. I cannot possibly begin to agree with this statement, especially in the context of a discussion of HIP.
If you want to start at the extremes why not compare recordings of Menuhin and Wallfisch?
On a more general note, any performance is about a series of decisions and the way these come together will produce an end result. In the concert hall the first decision may reside with the promoter - who will they book? Then (if we stick with the organ), there is a decision about what to play (though these first two decisions might be made hand in hand). If one is booked to play Buxtehude in (say) Truro Cathedral, then (assuming one accepts the booking) one has to choose where one stands on the continuum of "making the organ sound at it's best" and "getting as close as possible to the composers intentions". Possibly that is an extreme example, but if one has no grasp of the composer's intentions (no matter how sketchy that grasp might be due to the imperfect nature of research into the subject), how can one start to make such decisions?
I could go on (in fact I have done elsewhere with 10,000 words on approaching a performance of Schutz's choral music in a modern context), but I would urge you to remember that many of the decisions are set in stone way before the player touches the instrument.
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You are extremely lucky. I don't know of any church within quite a wide radius of Brighton (not southwards, obviously!) that gets anything like 40 weddings a year. Even major parish churches are lucky if they get 7 or 8.
Malcolm
I'm 2 down, 40 to go....
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I'm also considering applying a blanket fee to weddings to cover 'family' videos, rather than applying an extra fee if couples choose to divulge that they know the wedding will be videoed, having been bitten several times in the past. I'd be interested to hear how widespread applying such a fee is among the profession.
My church does this (and has done for at least the last 5 years). We make it very clear to couples that they have our permission to video and there is no need to be surreptitious about it (as if they would...)
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I was going to mention 'O Jesus, I have promised', which surely is about the only other hymn which can have so many tunes still sung to it regularly
Day of Rest
Thornbury
Wolvercote
Hatherop Castle
being the four most common, but I'm sure there are others. I'd opt for one of the middle two.
I never play 'O Jesus, I have promised' to Thornbury. I was playing for a hymn sandwich type service once and was less-prepared than I should have been
...'Thy hand, O God has guided' appeared in the same service. Disaster was averted only because I dropped my service sheet on the pedal board just before the first of these and it fell open at the second, and I realised what I was about to get into! -
I haven't seen many examples of costs of rehousing organs on this thread so far, though plenty of ideas circulating about the relative cost of new pipe and new digital. Do any members have figures that could be shared to help balance the discussion a bit? It always strikes me as a bit of a pity that some lucky churches seem to manage to find hundreds of thousands on a new organ when there are plenty of fine reduncant organs floating around, whilst other churches just go for the digital option. Without wanting to take new business away from our very fne organ builders, I wonder whether rehoused organs are considered often enough in the churches that have recently had brand new instruments installed? Is it really that despite the organs available, none were considered suitable for a transplant? In these eco-aware days, we should all be doing our part to encourage recycling...
My church is seriously considering redundant instruments as a first choice for various reasons, some cited above. The costs (we have discovered) are enormously variable and some of the following variables have arisen:
1) Most obviously, the condition of the instrument; is full restoration required, or can it be simply moved?
2) The shape of the instrument; we have a particular space - how does the instrument physically fit that. This can have an effect on casework and action.
3) Casework: If a new case is needed, either because the previous doesn't fit or because it can't be moved for whatever reason, or because there isn't any.
The other question where cost is concerned is about affordability. If a church raises say £150,000, that could translate into £300,000 if matched funding can be found. But only if you have the right instrument to do this with and can play your cards right.
And of course all this comes into play only when one can find a tonal match!
I can see why it might be easier to start from scratch...
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..............maybe you should have asked Santa for a new one!
A
.......maybe I have.....
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Over the past few weeks as the winter weather has set in I have endured the following:
1. Open Diapason 2 on Great giving up entirely
2. Open Diapason 1 (aka QE2's foghorn) being "slow" coming on
3. Great Trumpet sticking on (an interesting playover for Silent Night was how this announced itself
4. Top C# on the Tromba (being used as a replacement Gt Trumpet(!)) ciphering during midnight mass (cured only by shut down and restart)
5. Finally on Christmas morning I got to the end of Vierne 2 Final, forgot about the ciphering C#, so added the Tromba, and more or less simultaneously the pedal contact on G jammed. Perplexed looks form people as the final (mostly D major) chord died away leaving a vast pedal G and a piercing top C#.
Ah well, taking next Sunday off.
Merry Christmas
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What time of year will you be doing the concert? It could be nice to coordinate the cantata with the liturgical season, e.g. Wachet auf in advent.
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There are lots of Telemann Cantatas for voice, melody instument and continuo.
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Some good suggestions, although I would not have said that the first movement of Widor's Sixth Symphony was quite the right piece (the Final may be more appropriate - at least it is in a major key), nor something one could learn quickly in a couple of weeks, particularly if there are several accompaniments to practise.
Oops - yes, I meant the last mvt of Widor 6.
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Hello All,
I've just discovered that our organist has had to take leave over Christmas for family reasons, so as assistant I will be stepping in and covering all the services. This will be my first 9 lessons as the main organist (I've accomanied specific choir items in previous years).
I'm going to have my work cut out, since I have to fit in preparation for the choir accompaniments etc. alongside my day job and trumpet playing commitments. Which brings me to the subject question...
Does anyone have suggestions for a suitable voluntary for the end of 9 lessons, which will not require hours of preparation. As a guideline, I'm of aspiring ARCO standard.
Many thanks in advance!
Sq
At this stage I would be asking myself what I already play that might be suitable - (what do you have in the repertoire?) given the other commitments you outline. You mention that you are a trumpeter - would you be comfortable switching instruments and is there someone else who could accompany you if you were to play a trumpet piece at the end? I'm sure this would go down well.
On various instruments I have been known to play:
Bach: In dulci jubilo (various)
Bach: G major P+F (BWV 541)
Buxtehude: C major P+F+C
Mulet: Carillon-Sortie
Widor: 1st mvt, Sym 6
Widor: y'know, t'Toccata
Vierne: t'Final
Lefebure-Wely: Sortie in E flat
Hope this helps to spark some ideas.
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And how often does he accompany Stanford
How many pistons/playing aids did Stanford have? I have seen at least one Cathedral Organist play a Stanford setting (I forget which) without recourse to pistons - to prove the point.
but if you took a straw poll of cathedral assistants, how many of them would choose to accompany evensong on a Cavaille console, compared to a typical English one. If it's a matter of, the only way it's saved is to restore it, then I don't really think an English Cathedral is the right place for it.I also rather suspect that whilst there are plenty who would prefer to have a lovely H&H or Mander console, there are also plenty who would accept the Parr Hall instrument (and others) without. Perhaps a proper study into Cathedral organists' (and assistants') attitude to conservation versus modernisation would be interesting - they are the ones at the sharp end after all.
And one cannot help but notice that a lot of what seems to be played after Anglican services is music originally destined for the German Lutheran or French Catholic churches IME... I don't have a problem with that (I do it myself), but I would suggest that if we are prepared to do that, then perhaps we should be prepared to do the reverse.
I have accompanied Howells Hymn to St Cecilia on the Orgue de Choeur in la Trinité, Paris. It seemed to work OK.
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One I heard over the weekend.
An announcement at a carol service went as follows: the third verse of this carol is as follows—”Enough for him whom cheribum worship night and day; A breastful of mild . . . .” I may have misheard the ranconteur, but I thought it was alleged to have occurred during a live TV broadcast. I have certainly come across a service sheet from a cathedral in the south of England which contained the words “Cheribum and seraphim”. . .
Enough already.
David Harrison
I heard sung (when recording):
Enough for him whom cherubim worship day and night;
A breast full of milk and a manger full of [look of horror from choirmaster as he realises where this might be going] ...er do you mind if we do that again?
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OK, I do something like this - I've tried to talk in general terms rather than relate ot any specific instrument, page numbers refer to this: http://icking-music-archive.org/scores/buxtehude/BuxWV137/Buxtehude_Praeludium_137.pdf ://http://icking-music-archive.org/sco...udium_137.pdf (though I don't play from this usually):
Opening: Something quite big, including a pedal reed (taken off after the solo if too cataclysmic, though left on if at all possible)
From last three bars of first page: something lighter - ideally based around a principal stop an octave higher than the opening
Page 2, 2nd system, third bar, last beat: As opening
Fugue: Something lighter again, with pedal to balance - I also do cadential trills starting on the note
Page 6 2nd line: I sometimes go to a bigger registration here
Chaconne: Usually the same as the opening; perhaps something in reserve for last 5 bars
Awaits reasons why this is rubbish and should be ignored...
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speed, phrasing and registration,
(I should've mentioned its the BuxWV 136)
What sort of organ?
And do you mean BuxWV 137? (With the pedal solo to start) - Apologies if you don't 136 just doesn't ring bells for me.
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...who is hopefully going to have a lesson with Frederic Blanc at Notre Dame d'Auteil.
I had a lesson with Frederic Blanc on this organ a couple of years ago and learnt a lot. I seem to remember he said it was of very few unaltered Cavaille-Cols still around Paris, though I expect to be corrected on this. He made a real difference to my playing in a very short space of time. I really should return for another...
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I would be interested to know here how many folk trek to play the volumes from Novello, Faber and OUP on our historic legacy.
I'd recommend St Botolph's, Aldgate to all (esp. if in London). Very friendly and accommodating as well.
http://www.npor.org.uk/cgi-bin/Rsearch.cgi...ec_index=R01331
I'd love to see a place with really good choir having this sort of instrument.
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Indeed - that's why I wrote:
Oxbridge Colleges need eclectic instruments which in many folk's mind need to be accompanimental instruments first and foremost with a nod to one tradition or another if they can. Some have gone further than others in this way - but all have musicality which can inspire in one way or another. You mention places - I was being somewhat general but we both are on the same tack I would suggest.
N
Oh yes, so you did and so we are! Will read more carefully in future...
Does anyone know what similarly contrasting instruments those at the RCM/RAM etc have access to. Being in London not necessarily being the same thing as having access...
Obviously the RCM has Room 90 (which I privately refer to as Room 101, having not enjoyed an FRCO experience there!) and the RAM has Marylebone (and for the moment Duke's Hall)... what else is used?
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Different Oxbridge Colleges (which NB are not music colleges) have diferrent requirements. Some will require a very talented player. Some will require a good player who also has the skills (including people skills) to run a choir (over and above an occasional rehearsal). Some will require someone to play hymns at a weekly service and very little more. Which part of this spectrum is allegedly struggling for recruitment?
As for "a few Oxbridge colleges were virtually appointing organ scholars on the strength of successful candidates being able to locate the power switch for the instrument"... my own experience of this sort of situation would suggest that blowers are normally switched on for the candidate before the audition, rendering this skill rather useless as a means of differentiation.
Nigel, what you write about the inherent musicality of an instrument being most important I agree with, though I might suggest that even at a fairly low level of attainment acquaintance with a variety of different style instruments is useful. Possibly best if the instruments were VERY different; say, for example, exposure to Queen's and Exeter colleges in Oxford.
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Thanks for the interesting replies. Rereading my initial posting it looks a bit aggresive - it wasn't meant to be, just genuine intrigue!
...'Thy hand, O God has guided' appeared in the same service. Disaster was averted only because I dropped my service sheet on the pedal board just before the first of these and it fell open at the second, and I realised what I was about to get into!
Circulation of scores in the 17th & 18th Centuries
in General discussion
Posted
My expertise here lies more in Choral than Organ, but I would expect the dissemination process to be similar.
In the case of choral music it would seem that usually a score was sent (on request to either the composer or an institution), copied into part books (not always copied in score) and returned. Of course, it wasn't always the original MS that was sent - it might be a copy by the composer for the purpose, or some other copy, possibly scored up from a set of part books! There are some - notably examples of scores being copied, notably Hawkins' scores at Ely and Tudway's collection for Lord Harley.
Others may advise better for organ music, but I would imagine that either the original or a copy made for the purpose of being sent around to various petitioners would be sent and returned.
It is easy to imagine Organists, Composers and Gentlemen of the Chapel Royal facilitating this process, mostly being in waiting on alternate months and otherwise returning to their home institution(s).
Edit: Should have made clear that this reply is particularly aimed at English music...