Malcolm Farr
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Posts posted by Malcolm Farr
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Which Parry, by the way? C. Hubert, or Joseph (who gave us "Aberystwyth")?
Rgds,
MJF
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Mentioning a 64' stop (hypothetical though it may be) reminds me of a story - quite probably apocryphal, but one never knows ... - that when Sid Noad lowered the pitch of the Sydney Town Hall organ in the late 30s, he had considerable difficulty regulating the 64' Contra-Trombone. Some of the pipes, it is said, spoke as half-length 128' monsters. Now there would be a lofty ambition!
Rgds,
MJF
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Has this design some way been inspired a certain Mr Bournias?
Without doubt, no. I think one might reasonably surmise that only 129 stops - no disrespect here, cynic - is surely much too small to satisfy such lofty ambitions. Would the aim not be to create by far the largest organ in the British isles? Would not its mighty Pedal division be underscored by an incomparable Eclair 64'? And how could two mere 4 manual consoles suffice, when a certain little chapel in Rome - name of St Peter's, I think - was to be blessed with one of 10?
Rgds,
MJF
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No. I recently played an organ which had one (St Lorenz in Nuremberg, Steinmeyer 1937) but even after trying it out I wasn't sure what it was - some sort of bundle of mutations, it seemd; but it was only working on about 50% of the notes, and those were so quiet that it was difficult to establish anything at all.
Come to think of it, I have never played an organ with so many stops of which I'd never previously heard. Ever come across a "Lurenbass" before? Or a Meerflaut?
http://www.kirchenmusik-st-lorenz.de/orgeln/haupt.php?nav=2
B
Perhaps I ought to have asked what a théorbe is meant to be!
Rgds
MJF
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Pardon my ignorance, but can anyone tell me what a "théorbe" is?
Rgds
MJF
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I have no problem with Pierre's and Gary's line of thinking insofar as we are concerned with the creation of instruments for academic study and the recording of old music. However, I feel that it is very different when we consider the viability of the British organ as an instrument of general utility (and at least so long as music by composers such as Nares, Walond et al are consigned to the relative fringes).
If the common or garden variety British organ is to have a future, then it must fulfil the functions assigned to it - whatever they may be. For the most part, I expect that the "garden" will still most often be a church or chapel, in which it will retain a significant degree of of hymn machine function. However, this doesn't require, say, the resources and voicing of an Arthur Harrison of circa 1930. On the contrary, in my view new instruments by our hosts and other leading British builders provide excellent accompanimental material.
However, we should be thinking beyond this, and hence I raised the issue of repertoire in my original post. In this regard, I would, with respect, disagree with Pierre. If, despite the inherent quality of its manufacture, an Arthur Harrison of circa 1930 is generally considered to be of quite limited utility - and a number of threads in these fora testify to this - it is at least in part because it was not (so far as I know) built to satisfy the demands of any school of composition. True, British composers of the early 20th century seem to come off best on it - and funnily enough, I had mentioned Whitlock and Willan in my original post - but they come off still better on a more rounded instrument. If you have ever experienced their works at the Sydney Town Hall, you will surely know what I mean.
If there is to remain an identifiably British organ into the future, it should in my view permit convincing performances of those native British composers whose works are considered to be of sufficient standing - whoever they might be. The choice is obviously a subjective matter, and I readily confess that I am going through something of a Whitlock and Willan phase at the moment - but I do consider them worthy composers whose works will ultimately stand the test of time. It should also encourage a continuing native school of composition (and there is probably no better example than the French school in the wake of Cavaillé-Coll). And finally it should also permit convincing performances of works by significant composers from other schools - Bach (of course!), Reubke, Reger, Franck, Vierne, Messiaen ...
Ah, the beast of eclecticism, I hear you protest! Yes and no. I think it is one of the great positives of British organ design as practised by current leading builders that the style of voicing and character of choruses have the potential to offer far better access to many schools than, say, French instruments provide British composers, or German instruments provide French composers. Except when it has been taken to unnatural extremes, history tends to show that the British organ is naturally somewhat "middle of the road" in this respect. This is, as they say, a Good Thing, and should be fostered.
Rgds,
MJF
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In other current threads, MM has asked what materials would we use if we were to re-engineer the organ using technologies available today, and comments have been made regarding the nature of the English organ as a machine for hymn accompaniment and as a one man orchestra. Yet another thread is devoted to the preservation of the (existing) British organ heritage.
My questions are these: If we were to start completely afresh, what features would we include on the new British organ? What native repertoire would we regard as sufficiently significant to ensure that the new instrument were capable of rendering convincing performances?
For my part, I would certainly want an instrument that would do justice to Whitlock's Sonata in c, Fantasie Chorale No. 1, the Plymouth Suite as well as some of the shorter works, and, assuming that we are entitled to reclaim him from Canada, Willan's Preludes & Fugues in b and c, the Introduction, Passacaglia & Fugue in e flat, and the Five Preludes on Plainchant Melodies.
Rgds,
MJF
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The penultimate paragraph of this http://www.malcolmrudland.org/MRBIO.HTM is interesting, but I don't know if it refers to pipe or electronic instruments. I suspect the latter..........
G
Yes, a toaster would surely be the thing these days. And perhaps things weren't so very different in the past either. Following innate's lead above, it seems that the Britannic (Titanic's sister-ship) boasted what was most likely a steam-powered calliope rather than a true organ.
Rgds,
MJF
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The Swell Organ of an instrument I used to play had been enlarged by adding: an extra octave at the bottom of the Oboe to produce a Contra-Hautboy 16'; a Clarion 4'; and an octave coupler. Although the top octave of the (former) Oboe had been discarded, I don't think it was missed. On the contrary, the result was one of the best small Swells I've come across, all within eight speaking stops and the octave coupler:
Geigen Diapason 8', Lieblich Gedackt 8', Salicional 8', Gemshorn 4', Mixture 12:15, Contra-Hautboy 16', Cornopean 8' and Clarion 4' + octave coupler.
The three reeds were also playable independently on the Pedal.
Overall, probably the best use of octave coupling and transmission I've come across.
Rgds,
MJF
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I suspect organ-builders can be divided into two distinct groups: those that use half-draw stops and those that don't. The builders that favour them seem to use them in most of their organs. But no, I've never actually encountered one in the flesh. Are they always additive ie is the half-draw always fewer ranks than the full draw? Or could, say, the 17th rank in a mixture be present on the half draw but not in the full draw?
Half-draws are also used for undulating ranks in small organs, I think. A full draw will draw a diapason and the half-draw reduces the wind so it can be used with another 8' as an undulant. I don't know how successful this is.
The latter is the one circumstance that I've encountered, and there was no problem with the draw-stop action itself. However, the reduced wind supply didn't seem to suit the rank very well, and on the whole I wouldn't call it a success.
Rgds,
MJF
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There was some discussion along these lines on the PIPORG-L list some while back. You could try googling or ploughing through their archives which I think are available on http://www.albany.edu/piporg-l/lsvcmmds.html
Thanks innate, I'll check it out.
Rgds,
MJF
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I've never had to use half-draw stops stops in anger, but I've always wondered how easy it is to judge the half-draw point when playing at full tilt.
Having brought up the subject of half-draw stops, I must confess that I've only ever come across one myself. I don't know how its mechanism worked, and whether this is common, but it had a noticeable "catchy" point at the half-draw point so that it wasn't necessary to position it by the eyeball method. Has anyone else come across them?
Rgds,
MJF
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In what way "crippled"? Surely, if using this facility, you would not be using the manual concerned for the hands at that moment? Is that limitation what you mean?
Yes, exactly. I referred to "small instruments", but was in fact thinking of small two manual jobs, and in particular one where such a change had been made, viz. making the Swell Oboe playable at 4' pitch on the Pedal. It allowed much more variation and subtlety.
Rgds,
MJF
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Jumbo jets being mentioned in MM's thread "Re-engineering the organ", I was reminded of another mode of transport - that I'd many long years ago seen a photo of a ship's chapel with what appeared to be a console in view, albeit rather obscured. Now, I have a feeling that it was a Royal Navy battleship or battlecruiser, and the only reference that I can find to one having with a dedicated chapel was HMS Hood, which was sunk by the Bismarck in 1941. But I haven't found any reference therein to an organ (which would surely be too large for a warship, where space is generally at a premium) or harmonium. Does anyone know?
And has any liner ever boasted an organ? Some were so palatial that surely someone must have thought of this indulgence.
Rgds,
Cap'n Nemo MJF
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For a start, I suspect that we would see pipes made from ... fibreglass (as is used in many beginner- to intermediate level sousaphones) ...
Perhaps we'd see pedal reeds with fibreglass resonators wrapped around the console. The mind boggles ...
Rgds,
MJF
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By the way, was it Schweitzer who described Bach's Toccata & Fugue in F as having "monotonous grandeur", or some such? Whatever ... For me, the toccata is quite wonderful, but needs a grand instrument to do it full justice. In that context, while I'm quite sure that St Bavo and a few other places would provide as good a vehicle for it, I somehow don't think anything could actually better the STH. How often have you found yourself playing, only to feel your hair standing on end with the sheer exhilaration of the sound? (And I don't mean through the quality of the playing ...)
Rgds,
MJF
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What absolutely fascinates me, is the tonal similarity between the Bavo organ, and the Thomas Hill organ at Sydney Town Hall; both great organs of the world.
If ever there was a case for the recreation of the romantic British organ, this is it, without having to go the way of cloning Arthur Harrison/George-Dixon or Willis 3.
Now if they built a smaller version of THAT at Leiden, I may be tempted to forsake the boat and the ice-cream.
MM
Unfortunately, I have only heard St Bavo in recordings, so I'm not in a position to comment directly on the comparison. However, I have a little familiarity with the Sydney Town Hall instrument, and totally agree that it should be considered one of the "great organs of the world".
While MM necessarily speaks of it in the context of "recreation of the romantic British organ", in so many ways it transcends "mere" romanticism. Most particularly, its Great and Swell diapason choruses are essentially very classical: each is well balanced within itself, and very clear. (Correct me if I'm wrong, MM, but herein, I expect, lies the basis of your comparison.) Certainly, there is a vast gulf between the Great and the Swell - something that has occasionally been cited as a deficiency - but the fact that the Sydney City Organist since 1978, Robert Ampt, has never, or at least very rarely, let a recital pass without at least one Bach work, is surely a testament to the quality of the choruses and their overall utility in contrapuntal music. From memory, they speak on 3 1/2" pressure (except perhaps the Great no. 1, which I think is on the same pressure as the reeds), and the tone is not forced in any way. While some of the chorus mixture ranks are somewhat on the fluty side - which, from my limited knowledge of other broadly contemporaneous Hill organs, may not be uncommon - they are yet quite brilliant, and cap the choruses perfectly.
Yes, if I could have a smaller version of the STH where I am now, I'd be a very happy man indeed. Who wouldn't?
Rgds
MJF
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Come to think of it, carbon fibre filaments can also be woven into a strong, impervious fabric, which could be suitable for some wind-trunking uses.
Rgds,
MJF
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Very reasonable, too. Another option, then, might be to have the 19:22:26:29 ranks available on a half-draw, and all five ranks, 17:19:22:26:29, on a full-draw.
Rgds
MJF
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I tend to agree with Cynic's comment. The only reservation that I have relates to the provision of octave couplers to Pedal divisions in small instruments so as to provide 4' tone for solo work. It is far better to make suitable stops playable there at that pitch, or otherwise the manuals from which they are derived can be hopelessly crippled.
Rgds
MJF
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A really interesting question, MM ...
For a start, I suspect that we would see pipes made from heavy plastics, fibreglass (as is used in many beginner- to intermediate level sousaphones) and composites (eg. aluminium / carbon) in addition to wood and straight metal. Come to think of it, don't some manufacturers now make string instruments largely from carbon composites? Reed tongues (assuming that a newly invented organ included reeds similar to those to which we are accustomed ...) might also use composites.
I would expect consoles to be very plastic affairs, or - Heaven forfend! - perhaps brushed aluminium. I suspect that only very few would have the "Rolls-Royce treatment" of largely natural products.
And, as to the the range of stops that might be found, I wonder if we'd start by trying somehow to voice produce imitations of electric guitars and the like. Who knows what the musical use might be ...
Rgds,
MJF
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I expect that we will all have noted, either from personal experience with certain of their instruments or from reading their portfolio pages, that Mander Organs sometimes use 5 rank Mixtures in Pedal Divisions having the composition 17:19:22:26:29 (on a 16' basis). The presence of 3 1/5' rank undoubtedly gives more definition to the 16' line.
However, I've sometimes wondered if they've ever thought about splitting these into a 2-rank Tertian 17:19 topped by a 3-rank Mixture 22:26:29, which might perhaps provide increased versatility. Perhaps our host might care to comment?
Rgds
MJF
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"All Gas and Gaiters" for me.
Another tv reverend I loved - but in a serious role rather than a comedy - was Frank Middlemass as Herries in "To Serve Them All My Days". Now that was a wonderful serial: well acted, great production values, and quite moving. I haven't seen it in 15 years or so, I'd say, but I can still hear the school song in my head. Or at least a memory of it in my head ...
And what I now hear in my head is quite Hereford-ish. But where was it actually recorded? Does anyone know?
Regards (and best wishes for a happy and holy Christmas),
MJF
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In days of yore, one of the finer organs in Plymouth was a decent-sized, post-war, three-manual Nicholson in King Street (later Wesley) Methodist Church. It did make quite a fine sound. The church closed maybe five or six years ago and it was feared that the organ would be scrapped, but at the eleventh hour it was bought by Topsham parish church up on the Exe Estuary. Off it was shipped and everyone heaved a sigh of relief. An organ saved. Or was it?
To my horror, I have just learnt that it has never been installed. Apparently it is still lying in thousands of pieces in the Topsham's south transept. The organist there is reported as saying that the church (whose current organ is said to be quite nice) has lost interest in raising the money needed for its installation.
What a waste! From your comments and the details given in NPOR, I expect that it would have been quite fine instrument indeed.
Incidentally, NPOR describes this instrument as "IIIP49". Deducting the Choir and Swell tremulants (both of which are numbered) from the stops listed leaves only 48. However, there is clearly an error in the Great, where the Fifteenth is listed as "III 19.22.26", so that the details of the Fifteenth and Mixture have been somehow been amalgamated.
Rgds,
MJF
Harrison Harmonics
in Nuts and bolts
Posted
I read somewhere recently that Harrison & Harrison continued the 17th, 19th, flat 21st and 22nd composition of the Harmonics for about 2 1/2 or 3 octaves. What happened then?
It's been a long while since I've had access to an older Harrison, and it's not the sort of question I ever considered at the time. Now that I'm wondering, I'm not remotely near one: the nearest Harrison is some thousands of kms away from my current little oasis hideaway at the edge of a vast desert. (Geographically, I kid you not.)
Is anyone able to oblige with an answer?
Kind regards,
MJF