undamaris
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Posts posted by undamaris
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I may have missed a post whilst reading my way through all of this so please forgive me if I repeat anything! I can remember having to leave notes in the tuner's books to ask for piston registrations to be changed on quite a few organs! One organ I used to play was a Victorian war horse that had electro-pneumatic action with four pistons to the Swell and Great, four combination pedals to both the Swell and Pedal, and three pistons to a Choir organ with only five stops, all of which were 8, except for a 4,flute!
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Thank you very much Madorganist! That's the one I was looking for! I must admit my impatience took over when hunting through Youtube. I must remeber that what I'm looking for isn't necessarily the opeing bars of any work - lesson learned! I agree David, this is a much more inspiring piece of music for Songs of Praise - it has dignity I think, and definitely works as a wedding egress. I've often favoured Soler's 'Emperor's Fanfare' for weddings but that's pretty much dictated by the organ in the venue!
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I'm hoping any members could possibly help me. For some reason the other day, I was discussing Songs of Praise with a friend of mine, and we both remember the original opening music from the late 70's/early 80's. I was just becomming almost obsessed with the organ and this really caught my attention. It was solo organ, and was toccata like with a melody solo'd on a tuba in chords. My mother rang the BBC to find out the composer and was told it was by Simon Preston. I've searched high and low but not found it in any of his compositions! It's not by Herbert Chappell or Robert Prizeman either so that eliminates a couple more people as far as I'm aware! I would be very grateful if anyone could throw some light on this as I'm slowly sinking into a haze of gin trying to find the answer before my friend does! The state of my liver depends on all of your help!
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I was browsing through Harrison & Harrison's website today when I came across images of a 32' reed being made and its windchests for Cheltenham College Chapel. Does anyone have any further information on this as there was nothing on the H&H site giving anything else.
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Now I've got visions of the scene from "Airplane" where the woman playing the guitar knocks the drip out of the arm of the very sick girl!
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The 1884 Alfred Monk organ in St Stephen's Church, Cheltenham has rounded sharps. Norman & Neard tinkered with it in 1910 & 1912, then Nicholsons had a go in 1965, but I don't think the console was altered in any shape or form and I believe it's still retains the original keyboards
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I quite like a mixture of organists - how about a temperament of organ builders?
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There's the wedding scene at the end of the remake of A Miracle on 34th Street as well! It may be the Wedding march but it makes quite a marvelous noise! LOL
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Dear Lord - the organ in sanity and madness strikes again! Let's not forget Mr P Collins provided a 32' Rumble on the organ of Greyfriars Kirk in Edinburgh!
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I haven't come across a Celestial division before. Can anyone enlighten me as to why they are called this and why they exist. This is in particular relation to this instrument in Newcastle.
Thanks
Let's not forget the Echo Organ of Tewkesbury Abbey which lives on in the organs current form as the Apse division!
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This is well in touch with the current evolution of the ideas in Belgium today;
a 1854 Hook & Hastings organ was rescued in Portland, Maine, and is prestently
re-erected in Boom (about mid-way between Brussels and Antwerpen).
The opening is due this end May.
Here is a page with pictures and Specifications:
http://www.wallacepipeorgans.com/html/for_...ook%20Op173.pdf
Pierre
What a little gem! Strawberry Hill gothick at its best! So nice to see something coming from over the pond that isn't all bells and whistles - not that the organs from the States are in any way less musical or tasteful I hasten to add
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I used to sing in the choir at Christ Church before it got all too happy clappy, and remember the organ very well. The Rohr Quintade on the Great was an odd stop, and the only 8' that was usable really was an 8' Principal. The Harmonic Flutes on the Solo I believe were from the original Hill organ, and the Swell was seriously lacking in many ways - no Oboe, and the strings put on the Solo instead. You were stuffed if you wanted to get Romantic and use the Celeste against the Clarinet as they were both on the Solo! The whole thing wasn't helped by being buried in the "North" transept with the rear half of the gallery cut away in a vain attempt to allow the organ to speak. The choir used to process from the Baptistry at the west end of the church, where you could hardly hear a thing - even the Tuba Mirabilis was muted down to a Cornopean in its effect! It would be wonderful if funds would allow the organ to be "de-baroqued" as it were and returned to it's original position in the west gallery so it can speak down the length of the church once more - this would also improve the whole appearance of the west end by filling the aching void that was painted a pale blue as I remember, and screaming to have an organ back in its place!
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Not a printed howler, but I remember the choir I was a member of were doing Parry's "I Was Glad" as the anthem one Sunday,MANY years ago, before which the Vicar announced the choir would also be singing the "Viva Vagina"
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I heard talk of Lancaster Priory acquiring the organ of St Walburg's in Preston, and to be erected in the West Gallery should the funds ever materialise, but that looks ever more unlikely in the present economic climate. Very sad on two fronts in that an organ by Hill should be left to decay whilst another beautiful church elsewhere should remain without a pipe organ. The existing Makin organ in Lancaster Priory is showing it's age faster than any pipe organ would ever do, and should never have replaced the Harrison & Harrison organ that was sold off to make way for it. As for organs left to moulder in churches whilst the happy clappy brigade bring themselves nearer to God with some of the most unholy of musical instruments, I have read in some music periodicals that a backlash has begun in the Catholic church. People are lamenting the removal of their organs as the waning in fashion for guitar and drums based "praise" has started in earnest, as the thought it would attract younger people back to church has failed miserably. They are now fund raising in earnest to have the organ back in its rightful place as the instrument to lead worship. The C of E as usual drags its feet in these matters, but it won't be long before we see the trend happening here I don't doubt!
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To be serious for a bit, this is the key to it, and I know we have gone into this on other threads before. The voluntary at the end, as much as the voluntary before are part of worship, and part of our worship in particular. Our gifts are as organists, and we offer these gifts (whether paid or not) as part of worship, and as a gift to God. For someone to then get up and destroy that gift is at the best insensitive and rude and at the worst an offence to God himself. As a people we are here to worship God, and this includes the voluntary!
As an aside, the people who make these announcements tend to be the same people that complain when a baby cries in the service that it is interfering with 'their' worship'
Jonathan
Crying babies for me aren't a problem - it's the mewling spawn that so called 'enlightened' parents think should be allowed to wander up and down the aisles, crying, chatting, screaming or playing with toys, with no regard whatsoever to the sensitivities of other parishioners who want to listen to the music . If they can't respect the msic how can they understand what God's saying?
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According to a comment by a contributor to Youtube, it appears that plans for the new Dobson organ in the chancel are currently on hold due to lack of funds. Anyone know anything about this?
Wouldn't surprise me about that as even the recession's affecting the USA, but I've not seen anything on their website to the contrary! Similarly, there's nothing on the Casavant Frere website to suggest they're not in a position to fulfill their contract for the West End Organ! I'm uber curious as to what the final plan for the organ is - we're not even getting a taste of what the final specification will be! Dear Lord - it's the middle of summer yet I feel like a kid waiting for Christmas! LOL
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To the best of my knowledge this is correct. I understand that he was offered the whole of the old Llandaff Cathedral instrument, the whole of the Worcester Cathedral instrument (bar a single Hope Jones Viole rank) and all the four-manual Willis that used to stand in Holy Trinity Coventry. He has an awful lot in store! I gather that much of the stock is kept in wooden sheds (no harm in that) and lock-up garages. Some years ago I enquired after something only to learn that (allegedly) some of his stock had recently been torched by the locals.
However, if anyone wanted to return the organ in Christ Church, Cheltenham to its 'echt' original state, what they should be looking for is old Hunter material, not 1950s Nicholson!
Lordy! I remember this organ from my time in the choir there. A very strange set up indeed having a choir of cathedral ability in an evangelical church veering towards the "happy clappy" by the time I left. I always remember as a choir we processed to the stalls from the baptistry at the back of the church, where the organ was all but inaudible - the tuba was just about the only thing you could hear and full organ was incredibly muted! No wonder when you consider they crammed the instrument into the north transept with half the gallery cut away at the back. I can only imagine what it must have sounded like when it was in the west gallery and spoke down the nave! I seem to remember the harmonic flutes on the Solo being from the original Hill and still there. I also remember some very odd voices that appeared to have been added in the name of 'baroque-ising' the instrument (when they stripped it of anything 'romantic' and relegated it to the Solo, namely the clarinet and strings/celeste), the Rohr Quintade of which immediately comes to mind, which was so coarse and 'breathy' that it defied description! The 12th harmonic was so pronounced that you really only needed to add the tierce and the 4ft and you virtually had a cornet separet. The only times I've heard such pronounced twelfths is from the 16ft bourdon's resulting from the hands of some rather artless voicers.
There are some plus points though! The Posaune on the Great I seem to remember being very clear and quite free in tone - which was a lovely foil to the Tuba Mirabilis, and the 32 Sub Bourdon, which had an incredible presence considering how it was in the area of the organ where the flower ladies though nothing of using it as a notice board, and even using the mouths of the pipes as extra shelving! Amazing how some of those pipes spoke when they were full of Pledge and dusters, but then this is the fate of many an organ I fear.......
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Does anyone know what Dr Massey is up to these days? He doesn't seem to do many recitals and I certainly miss the opportunity of hearing him play.
I remember listening to him play on numerous occaisions - a consumate master. The choir I sang with used to deputise at Hereford, and what a joy it was to sing there with him in control - I have to say he was head and shoulders above most people when it came to pointing psalms - just had THE knack!
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As an ex-organist and now a vicar, I don’t quite know how to react to these comments. As not infrequently happens, the general tenor is verging towards ‘you’re at fault if you don’t like organ music.’ Here are some thoughts. How many organists go off to do something else during the sermon? How many choir members are seen fiddling with their books during the lessons, or sermon, or liturgy? How often do we witness whispered conversations during the liturgy? I have been guilty of all this. Like (all of?) you, I deplore announcements during the voluntary, but the general level of conversation is usually so high, and the organ so tucked-away or gentle that it has a job to be heard at the best of times, and people can be forgiven for not realising that there is something worth listening to that has been practised—IF there is and it has.
If all churches had quality organists on quality organs in quality acoustics, in a culture that valued quality and standards, we might begin to hope that organ music would be valued more in our churches. People might then wish to wait until the volly was over. When I first started this vicaring lark, I thought I would miss decent music more than I do, but now I am content with hymns well played (I’m generally happy to let the organist choose them), and music that is well within the competencies of the musicians. Other things seem more important. It’s no good criticising me for a poacher-turned-gamekeeper attitude, because this is the way it is for me at the moment. Do I want to have to deal with the ‘prickliness’ of some organists and church choirs? On the whole, I think not.
I feel I have to take issue with this! Due to the poor status organists and organs are now being given in the present "happy clappy" way of worship, it's a very sorry state of affairs for an ex-organist now priest to have a go at the people who supply the backing for worship every Sunday. These people are there doing what they love every Sunday, without any financial gain, unlike the clergy, who unlike the rest of us don't have to pay council tax! All well and good complaining about choir members not paying attention to the sermons, but perhaps if the preacher was an interesting one then there would be less "fiddling" in the stalls, cantoris or decani, never mind the empty nave in front that the churches are complaining about these days.
Church musicians are never accorded the status they're due half the time anyway - just look at the majority of church websites - very rarely is there mention of the organ, and if they even mention the organist or choir master, then they appear after the flower arrangers if at all! (Many apologies to all flower arrangers! You do a valuable job!)
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Pardon my ignorance again! I have been playing for 40 + years but have only once actually played an organ withan Unda Maris. As I was about 8 at the time and I am now 50, I have forgotten what it sounded like.
I know the difference between a Voix Celeste and a Vox Angelica, but part from it being an undulating rank, I am in the dark. Can anyone enlighten me please?
Incidentally, the organ concerned was in Wilmslow United Reformed Church (then Congregational). The pipe organ has gone in recent years - don't suppose anyone remembers it? (3 manual with fine casework as i remember - Unda maris was on the Choir)
I remember playing the (now) defunct organ in Holy Trinity, Coventry way back in the 80's, and it had an Unda Maris on the Solo Organ, and that was a flute celeste - makes a change from some of the the more usual "stringent" celestes we hear by more modern builders these days
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I've always had a fondness for the Milton organ in Tewkesbury Abbey, looking quite delicious now on its new raised gallery! There's also an exquisite little gem of a Georgian case in the now redundant church of Saint John the Baptist in Lancaster - which reminds me - let's not forget the newly restored Waring & Gillow case in the Ashton Hall in Lancaster!
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You'd better come clean and say which cathedral organs you have in mind, because having played just about all of the cathedral and other "great church" organs in the midlands and south west in the last year or two I can't think of a single one that matches your description.
I also can't imagine that anyone would seriously suggest that organ voices on a "traditional" english solo organ accurately match the sound of the orchestral instrument on the stop knob. So what? What's your point here? These are organ voices, and from an organist's point of view one only expects them to match an organ stop of the same name. Like it or not these are part of our heritage.
I find this generalised dismissal of the tuba stop to be divorced from reality. I'm told the Durham Cathedral organ has 3 tubas. I've not heard it and cannot therefore judge, but it seems reasonable to assume that if all are coupled through as a part of the tutti this might be excessive. By contrast, if you take the single tubas at Hereford, or that at Salisbury, as examples, these are bright, ringing solo voices. Far more musical I would suggest than many of the chamade reeds perhaps preferred by some.
I feel I have to agree! There IS a place for our wonderful tubas - CS Lang and Mr Cocker would be rolling in their graves at all of this! Can anyone seriously imagine "I was Glad" opened by a chamade reed with all the presence of a high pressure kazoo? It just wouldn't work! Just the same as a Willis Corno di Bassetto would no more pass for a cromorne or krummhorn in early French or German music. Each stop has its place according to the era and tastes that the music composed for it allows - and even calls for. Mr Hollins specified an Orchestral Trumpet for his (in)famous minuette after all, which also makes purists cringe.
I have to admit that over the years some of our tubas have hardly been musical, but wouldn't you if you hadn't recieved a bit of regulation after a couple of decades? I can cite the incredible Tuba Mirabilis at York for one - I have recordings of it where almost each note is of different tone and power. These seem to be what "purists" decry these stops for at times, but they also seem to be the same people who glory in the dissonance of historically "un touched" reeds of some Iberian organs solely because of their age never mind their musical ability.
Hill developed the most wonderful high pressure reeds we have so much to be thankful for, that characteristic "yell" those reeds have! Willis built on this, giving us a sound more akin to something from a furnace - they almost crackle! As for Lewis - just listen to Southwark Cathedral - as far as I know even Willis didn't tamper too much with this leaving us another reed to be proud of!
I'm an Englishman and I love my tubas! They have a place in our wonderful musical heritage - I'm also a musician who loves chamade reeds and all their fire and power when they are voiced and used properly and sensitively - but above all, I admire the organist who recognises the value of these stops and uses them with the discretion and with due defference to the music in which such reeds are called for.
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Well, I for one enjoyed it very much. Thank you Peter!
Great job orchestral music transcribes over to the organ better than the other way round!
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I suggest that as not all victims of the Holocaust were Jews!
Winter weather
in General discussion
Posted
I imagine Gordon Reynold's advice about laying in a stock of glycerin to keep the hoar frost off the trebles would be rather redundant advice across the pond...