jonadkins
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Posts posted by jonadkins
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They seem to have had a good crop of assistants at Gloucester in recent years, besides Robert. I've always been impressed whenever I've heard David Bednall, and Ian Ball before him managed to emerge from Briggs' shadow.
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At the end nowadays, unless there is a specific request, I tend to go for something "big" , eg from Bach the Piece d'Orgue, Allabreve, "Wir glauben al", Fantasia & Fugue in g, etc
I find that the Piece d'Orgue has been well received whenever I've played it (and I mean that as a testament to the music, rather than my playing thereof!) It helps, I think, that there is a contrast of textures between the inner and outer sections.
Also, "the" Widor has been requested twice now at funeral/memorial services.
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Maybe it is just me, but I was distinctly underwhelmed by the Buxtehude.
I just thought it was the wrong organist, playing the wrong organ and the wrong music, as I sat stone-faced listening to it.
I was reminded of another well-known organist who shall remain nameless, playing the Bruhns G major on an organ which should have been perfect for the role. The notes, as ever, were faultless, but there was just no empathy with the music, or any real understanding of the "fantastic style," which should be about abrupt changes of emotion, rather than just alterations to the timing and registration. That recording was not even in the same artistic league as the recording I most like, played on the largely Schnitger organ of the Aa- kerk, Groningen by Peter Westerbrink; a name which I feel sure will be instantly recognised internationally.
With the death of Luciano Pavorotti, I was reminded of something said of him, (by whom I do not know), and which seems so absolutely right about music and musicians generally.
"Pavarotti was never the most accomplished vocal technician, but he WAS the greatest singer in the world."
That's because it came from the soul.
Buxtehude was a bit of a wild man who liked to party, and most British organists are not. Perhaps that is the bit that is frequently missing!
Sorry!
MM
No, don't apologise MM. I forget whether it was Flanders or Swann who said "chacun a son gout"
You're right about the Stylus Phantasticus thing though. I remember being stunned by the Bruhns e minor Prelude (the longer one) the first time I heard it. Is the recording you mention at Groningen still available?
ps Not sure about the British organists/party animals comment: Many is the time I've thought "To hell with it" and had a SECOND cup of Earl Grey tea...
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Just to say how much I enjoyed John Scott's Buxtehude at the proms on Monday, both in terms of interpretation and regisration. For me, Buxtehude is not the first composer's name that springs to mind when the RAH organ is mentioned, but Scott carried it off marvellously, managing to get a surprising transparency from the instrument, something which I thought would be difficult.
Did anyone else hear it?
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This is the sort of thing that can make the HOC system suspect. We all know that organs can be changed for the worse, and also that outstanding pipework can be spoiled by needless alterations.
Yet there is more than one way of looking at history. A lot of what gets categorised as historic is in fact frozen in time. An awful organ that remains original and of its time could I suppose be eligible for an HOC - and someone could more easily get support for a restoration. A fine organ in need of work but having been (well) altered to allow it to meet the needs of the different times it has served - it isn't in the running - even though it might be historic in the sense of making a long-term impact on a building or community (or providing evidence of varying musical tastes or needs).
HOCs by all means - but let's be aware of the limitations on their significance and make heritage bodies aware that there are other things that matter historically.
Exactly. What is the Grand-Orgue at St Sulpice besides a triumphant marriage of the work of Cavaille-Coll with that of Cliquot before him?
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Small - Hexham Abbey (Phelps)
Medium - Is St Chad's Birmingham too big? My mind's going blank here: It's very good, but there must be others I've overlooked - perhaps Greyfriar's Kirk?
Large AND Cathedral - Westminster Cathedral
Very Large - St George's Hall, Liverpool
Town Hall or similar - Reading Town Hall
Overall - Too difficult, but if one HAD to choose, then Westminster Cathedral.
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Good news, certainly, that a major post-romantic composer
for the organ regains interest.
Next step now is to take his british equivalents out
of the purgatoire...
(Yes, I'm already flying to the Falklands).
Pierre
Any chance of some names, Pierre?
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Elgar's Vesper Voluntaries. It is definitely a mistake to play the whole lot in a single recital - I know because I sat through them once. Fortunately there was a beautiful building to look at to relieve the utter boredom.
Yes, perhaps the whole lot at a recital is a bit much, but I must confess to quite liking the Andantino...
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Just recieved details of the music for a wedding I'm doing in the Minster in a couple of weeks. The recessional is
Widor (Charles Murray) Decata in F
Anyone know where I can get a copy??
Try Kevin Mayhew publishing...
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Does anyone else share my amusement at the way some people inflate their biographies in recital programmes? Obviously you're going to make the most of what you've done, but some people do seem to go a bit far. You know the sort of thing:
1) Someone describes himself as Assistant Organist of St Freidegg's Cathedral when in reality he's no such thing. All he probably does is to play hymns on Sundays during August or help out in other peripheral ways. (I've come across this one more than once!)
2) "She has just released her first CD." All this involved was getting a local chap in to make a small batch for her to sell privately to friends and on the church's bookstall.
Does it matter? Am I just being a Victor Meldrew?
I trust it is obvious that the above is in no way aimed at the professional players on this forum. They don't need to exaggerate anything. More likely they have the opposite problem – deciding what to leave out!
As far as my own biog goes I must admit that there's one word that I really ought to tone down a bit, though I think the subtle inflection would be lost on most people. Otherwise I think it sticks to the facts. Heaven knows it strikes me as a bit thin – but, hey! something about me needs to be!
Sounds as if you could do with reading double bass player Pete McCarthy's bio notes as they appeared at the Tetbury Music Festival programme a couple of years ago: "Peter started to study the double bass after having failed on every other instrument" How about that for some refreshing candour! Pete, I might add, is a very fine bass player and the Tetbury music festival has featured artists of the calibre of Isserlis, Mark Padmore and Emma Kirkby, just to put it in context!
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Hope you don't mind me adding to this thread as I have a bit of a vested interest in the subject.
The improvisation competition at St Albans in my experience is a bit variable in the standard of the competitors from year to year. So we have had excellent winning improvisers in the past (Mourik in 05, Houssart in 03, and before them Baker, Briggs, Hakim, Bovet etc). This is only the third time since 1971 that the jury hasn't awarded the prize (and in 1999 the competition was cancelled due to a low standard of entrants).
In the end it's all down to what happens on the day. This year the two finalists didn't come up to a standard which would uphold the high standard of the competition which has been set over the years by players such as those named above. We wouldn't do the reputations of ourselves, the previous winners or any of the recent competitors any good by awarding a prize when the playing fell below an acceptable standard.
Where they fell down this year (and indeed where all the competitors in the semi-final except one) was in their ability to improvise within a disciplined style. This is something expected of concert improvisers if not often expected of liturgical improvisers. The prospectus was published 18 months ago but it was obvious that most hadn't done enough preparation, particularly in terms of style, harmony and counterpoint. Unfortunately the one player who did do this part particularly well then gave an extremely poor improvisation in the final - it just wasn't his day. Some need to learn that it's just not good enough at this level of competition to make all your improvisations in one style, with one basic idea.
On the whole I don't feel that it would serve the organ world well not to have an improvisation competition in the St Albans Festival. I'm sure it spurs young people on to improve their improvising skills, but I hope that any prospective competitors will note that relying on inspiration on the day rather than hard graft over a long period of time will inevitably mean they will be found out.
I hope this clarifies the situation.
Andrew
A very sound position to take. Had I been a competitor (with pigs listening to my efforts from overhead) I certainly wouldn't have wanted to win under false pretences, with folk saying "yes, but it was a thin year that year, wasn't it?"
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I have recently bought a recording of Marie-Bernadette Dufourcet playing extracts from L'Orgue Mystique (Mostly Chorales Alleluiatiques) with high expectations, having greatly enjoyed the Cinq Improvisations, but must confess to finding my recent purchase a little hard going to listen to. Maybe its just me, but this music doesn't seem to have the freshness, the vitality of "Victimae Paschali" for example. Nothing against the player: Mrs. Hakim is more than equal to the task, and certainly nothing against the organs: La Trinite for most of it, and even Sacre-Coeur for two of the pieces. It's just the music, which is almost turgid in places, despite sounding technically demanding.
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While I await (with interest) this scheme, I recall that you mentioned a four-clavier instrument. With this in mind, I offer the following:
PEDAL ORGAN
Sub Bourdon (Ext.) 32
Contra Bass (W) 16
Violone (M) 16
Salicional (Great) 16
Bourdon 16
Octave (M) 8
Violoncello 8
Flute (Ext.) 8
Fifteenth 4
Mixture (12-17-19) III
Contra Bassoon (W; ext.) 32
Grand Bombarde (M) 16
Bassoon 16
Trumpet 8
Shawm 4
Chaire to Pedal
Great to Pedal
Swell to Pedal
Bombarde to Pedal
COMBINATIONS
Pedal and Great Pistons Coupled
Pedal to Swell Pistons
Generals on Swell Foot Pistons
CHAIRE ORGAN
Open Diapason 8
Wald Flute 8
Stopped Diapason 8
Prestant 4
Chimney Flute 4
Quint 2 2/3
Recorder 2
Tierce 1 3/5
Octavin 1
Cimbel (29-33-36) III
Tremulant
Swell to Chaire
Bombarde to Chaire
GREAT ORGAN
Contra Salicional 16
Quintatön 16
Open Diapason 8
Rohr Flöte 8
Flûte Harmonique 8
Cone Gamba 8
Octave 4
Gemshorn (Conical) 4
Flûte Harmonique 4
Octave Quint 2 2/3
Super Octave 2
Mixture (19-22-26-29) IV
Bass Trumpet 16
Posaune 8
Clarion 4
Chaire and Great Exchange
Chaire to Great
Swell to Great
Bombarde to Great
SWELL ORGAN
Open Diapason 8
Flauto Traverso 8
Viole de Gambe 8
Voix Célestes (CC) 8
Geigen Principal 4
Suabe Flöte 4
Fifteenth 2
Plein-Jeu (22-26-29) III
Corno di Bassetto 16
Hautbois 8
Voix Humaine 8
Tremulant
Cornopean 8
Clarion 4
Sub Octave
Unison Off
Octave
BOMBARDE ORGAN
Montre 8
Flûte à Pavillon 8
Principal 4
Furniture (12-15-19-22-26-29) VI
Cornet (1-8-12-15-17: TG) V
Cremona 8
Tremulant
Bombarde 16
Grand Ophicleide 8
Orchestral Trumpet 8
Orchestral Clarion 4
Sub Octave
Apologies if you've already said and I've missed it, but which currently functioning firm would you want to build this marvellous theoretical beast?
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Again, many thanks to all who have posted, some very helpful advice has been given. It would seem that simplicity and discipline are the order of the day, ie make sure the notes you play are there for a reason, and not just as a result of "doodling".
It also helps not to beat yourself up if your first efforts don't sound like Briggs or Tournemire.
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In principle, I think it wrong to charge, because the people other than the main organists using the instrument will be students who should be encouraged. Other people, who just want to use the organ as a "leisure facility", not making any liturgical contribution, leaving swell boxes closed, changing settings, moving music etc. should not be allowed access at all.
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How wonderful! At the funeral of a long-time parishioner and long serving churchwarden during Easter week, the family had asked for variations on 'On Ilkley Moor baht 'at' - which is what they got! all round.
And at christmas you can say it's variations on "While Shepherds watched" of course!
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Most illuminating replies, thanks everyone. I guess there are no "short cuts"!
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Yes, I like this work too. It has shades of Glass/Reich of course, but with more charm. I've got the Symphony hall recording, but as with all that he plays, Thomas Trotter makes it sound so easy.
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On a good day I would describe myself as a passable organist, but I am not good at improvising, which is a shame as it is necessary at our services. I did once have the privilege of attending a Briggs "workshop" at Gloucester Cathedral, at which he did his best to try and explain what he learned from Langlais, but he did rather leave our heads spinning with his technique when he, as he put it "knocked a couple of themes about" at the end. As another attender memorably put it: "Well, I was confused at the start, now I'm confused at a much more exalted level!"
Now, I fully realise the difficulty of trying to encapsulate in a post what would take years of training in France, but can I appeal to the breadth of experience and knowledge on this board and ask "What would be your one, overriding piece of advice about trying to improve improvisation?"
Thanks in anticipation,
jonadkins
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Three, now, surely. An excellent arrangement of two Baroque instruments in juxtaposition - ideal for duets - and a new 'Romantic' at the west end.
By the way, when I visited Ottobeuren I found the contents of the glass cases in the crossing rather scary.
John
Apologies for my ignorance - I have not visited the Abbey, and am only aware of the organs through Ton Koopman's (IMO excellent) Bach recordings. In addition, perhaps now is not the time to admit that when I first glanced at the word "Dreifaltigkeit" in relation to the organ there, I thought, did'nt I, that it meant that it had three manuals!
Anyway, those glass cases sound intriguing...
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You can play whatever you like, although some JSB works seem to demand the fugue, for example the Fantasia (of BWV 537) which ends on the dominant.
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I find it fascinating that Ottobeuren Abbey has not been mentioned (both instruments divine, but would plump for the Dreifaltigkeitsorgel)
Ingolstadt Munster
St. Ouen, Rouen
(For a UK instrument I would probably pick Coventry Cathedral)
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How fortunate for you that he responded with such restraint and humility!
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In which case I hope that you enjoy the recital!
However, I would prefer something quite different (absolutely no transcriptions, a whole symphony - Widor or Vierne, a decent slice of Bach - perhaps the B minor - and then a good improvisation).
I recognise that we all have different tastes and that we should do whatever we can to encourage people from all walks of life to give the organ a try (not necessarily literally). Notwithstanding, please do not forget that some of us do like a slightly more 'highbrow' programme. Wild horses would not drag me in to listen to the one quoted above....
Having said that, I quite understand the point made by french amateur - and I agree that programming The Art of Fugue is not the best way of inculcating a love of the organ to the uninitiated. This said, I do believe that there is a more acceptable middle ground, which would still be pleasing to many - both lovers of music and the cognoscenti.
I realise that in my last post I must have sounded like one of those "I don't know much about art but I know what I like" people. Of course I love a more "serious" recital: what could be better than Daniel Roth playing Franck or Widor, or Gillian Weir doing all of the Livre du Saint-Sacrement? (OK, some of you might have suggestions!) I suppose it's just that Trotter plays those transcriptions so well, and as musically as he would play any Vierne or Alain. At first I didn't think that I liked them, and would groan inwardly when I saw one on a programme. But, wouldn't you know it, Trotter began to work his evil magic (a bit of stunning technique here, some judicious registration there, some genuinely good bursts of music) that my soul was eventually sold lock, stock and bon gout to the devil!
Still can't stand that bloody Bell Rondo, though.
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<Rant alert!>
I've just picked up all five of these CDs on ebay and, while I don't regret the purchase for one minute, I'm glad I didn't pay the RRP for them. Interpretation is a very individual thing, of course, but I'm afraid Rübsam doesn't do it for me. Unlike John, I find his playing positively bizarre. I'm all for flexibility and expressiveness in Romantic music, but surely Rübsam's continual "stop and start" style goes too far? It seems to me to be at the expense of the architecture and symphonic form. In particular I find his habit of systematically pausing before the first beat of the bar intensely irritating. Together with his ever changing tempos, these traits combine to destroy all sense of rhythm to the extent where, unless I already knew the movement in question I couldn't tell what on earth was going on. The opening of Sonata no.4 has always struck me as being like the first movement of a Brahms symphony, but can you ever imagine an orchestra playing it like Rübsam does? I'm sure the failing is mine since I've a sneaking feeling that Brahms, whose playing is said to have been so flexible and expressive that all sense of rhythm frequently disappeared, would heartily approve!
So my question is this: if I want a "straighter", yet still warmly expressive and Romantic interpretation of these pieces, whose set should I get? Innig's?
My mother taught me never to trust a man with a moustache like that...
I agree with people about Rheinberger 8, but to my mind the finest passacaglia since Bach's is Frank Martin's.
Metronome Marks
in General discussion
Posted
Few posts have made me laugh as much as this one! I have one of those metronomes as well.
The John Scott Aides-memoire are also wonderful, but I'm sorry that I was never in St Paul's cathedral when he played Happy Birthday or Col. Bogey. Now I'll never get the chance...
My teacher once said that there are two types of metronome markings: Too fast, and Too slow.