gazman
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Posts posted by gazman
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I agree with the comments about seeing new organs like Worcester etc. I also agree about Nigel's enthusiasm and also his common sense.
However I am not happy in the way Mander Organs have treated this posting. It seems that the initial posting was so powerful that it caused offence to Mander Organs and how does one know what the person said when the post has been deleted? That seems rather unfair to me. I've read over and over again the guidelines of the Mander forum and I can not see why they would just willy nilly delete a post without justification. There is a sentence saying
"The messages express the views of the author of the message, not necessarily the views of this bulletin board. Any user who feels that a posted message is objectionable is encouraged to contact us immediately by email. We have the ability to remove objectionable messages and we will make every effort to do so, within a reasonable time frame, if we determine that removal is necessary".
So who was the person who found it necessary to delete this post?
It goes on to say that " We have the ability to remove objectionable messages and we will make every effort to do so", but it does not say that it has a legal right!
The "guidelines" also go on to say "This discussion forum is to be used only for non-commercial purposes. Participants may not solicit funds, promote commercial entities or otherwise engage in commercial activity in the forum." Well what about Worcester Cathedral, Youtube films and the latest one "Classic FM Hall of Fame, Your chance to show that the organ really matters - There's plenty of organ music on the list at http://www.classicfmhalloffame.co.uk/#votingForm and what better way to get ourselves and the organ heard."! (apologies to Nick Bennett for use of his link!) Oh and another one "Recitals, Alert your fellow organists!".
All these are in breach of the above clause, but have Mander organs deleted them ? Of course not!
Next one is this :-
Forum Misuse Policy:
* 1st Offence
A polite Private Message from a Moderator pointing out the Forum Rules, in addition to the editing or deletion of the post
* 2nd Offence
Public warning on the message board plus deletion of post
* 3rd Offence
Moderators will delete the user from the Mander Organs forum,
Depending on the situation, Moderators may bypass any and all of these steps and take whatever action is deemed appropriate.
I have to ask this did the person in question receive a polite message or did Mander Organs just jump to No.2 and publicly humiliate the said person? They seem to be contradicting their own clauses.
I'm sorry to have ignited in this field but I have found that no matter how against the guidelines one might be it is of the mood of the Mander forum if such a person should be deleted or not.
Are Mander organs really being fair?
p.s I'm copying this just in case it gets deleted!!
My, my!
I don't think that most of your points are directly applicable to this case. Mander Organs provide this fascinating forum at their own expense. Whilst it's very interesting to read threads about new organs, at the end of the day you have to remember that Manders is a commercial concern who have already generously allowed considerable 'publicity' for other organ builders and their work (the threads about the other Aubertin and Worcester Cathedral spring instantly to mind). Whilst these threads have been most interesting to read, I must confess to having felt a pang of guilt when contributing to them as we are, by doing so, promoting the work of competitors.
The moderators have the ability to delete posts and entire threads. They obviously have decided, in this case, to request that this thread isn't further promoted by the OP. They certainly haven't 'publicly' humiliated the OP nor - as far as I'm aware - deleted him! They have also allowed the links given by the OP, when quoted by others, to remain in situ, so we can still view the photographs.
Whilst no doubt this would have been an interesting thread, and I'm sorry to see it pass, in answer to your final question, and for the reasons I've given, yes, I think that Manders are being fair and reasonable and I understand their reasoning.
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I love the Latin stop names of the Torbay instrument and can imagine the discomfort of a young organ student who suddenly had to have a crash course in Latin before being able to sort out his registrations! I have relatives in the area and would have very liked to have seen those before they went.
I'm told that the console from St. John's, Torquay, remains in storage in the basement of Torquay Museum, complete with its Latin stopknobs. A friend of mine, who played there for a few months in the 1950s before the Latin stopknobs were removed, said it looked quite confusing at first inspection because the pitch was also given in Roman numerals.
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Now, how do I spell Gedackt ;- am I bovvered!!
You oughta be!
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Incidentally, I loved one of the comments posted below the video: "I wished I were the organist at the church. Its possible that she didn't tune the organ very good. There is usually a dial on the side."
And the one which said 'It's not out of tune, but tuned in a so called unequal temperature'. The temperature sounds like it fluctuated every few minutes whilst it was being tuned!
As Vox observed, why play 'Nun Danket' on an organ tuned to an unequal temperament?
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I have just received a copy of the new catalogue from Priory.
The second paragraph contains an interesting statement: "...where you will see for the first and last time the organ, soon to be replaced by a new instrument."
I was aware that there had been discussion for some time concerning the rebuilding of the Willis/Mander instrument (and the possibility of providing another instrument in the nave). However, I was surprised to learn that the existing organ is to be replaced - I wonder if whoever wrote the copy actually meant that?
A cursory search of the internet has shed no further light on the matter, so I would be interested to learn from any board members what is happening - if, in fact, anything is actually known yet.
PM sent.Intriguing!
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I have just returned from Wayne Marshall's concert on the Royal Albert Hall organ this evening and wondered if anyone else had been there. Was it just me or did most of the programme appear to be played at break neck speed? I expect variations in tempo from different organists, but when it becomes difficult to recognise the piece being played, I find it hard to appreciate the music.
I seem to remember hearing him give a series of concerts on the radio (in place of 'The Organist Entertains'?) a few years ago. I recall one of his comments before launching into his next piece: "So-and-so was known as a virtuoso organist, but I bet he couldn't play as fast as me". That said it all about his playing, as far as I was concerned.
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3. If the organ were to be restored properly in an English cathedral I can't imagine any current cathedral organist would put up with such a primitive device. No pistons, no sequencer, no surround-sound nave section.
Can't see it, somehow.
The team seemed very keen on it when I played there last. It would certainly be far better than the awful electrone in place at present.
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This is a very interesting topic, a few weeks ago I had a Wedding that only wanted cds played, they were informed by the Rector that they had to pay my fees in full and the video fee as it was deemed to be loss of income on my behalf. When they realised the cost they came back to the organ!!!! My contract is very clear over this matter.
That sounds good. On the odd occasion when I've been asked to stand aside for another organist to play, I've not received the video fee, having been told that the incumbent thought it unreasonable.
Over the last couple of years or so I've had one wedding where they asked the church's 'music group' (basically a keyboard which plays MIDI files as nobody in the music group has any keyboard skill), a trumpeter and a couple of singers) to provide the music instead, and another where they decided not to use the organ after they were told that I would charge a retainer fee and got their 'organist' friend to play the piano instead (I hear he mangled the music, so goodness only knows what he'd have done on the organ). In both these cases I didn't get paid a fee because the incumbent said that the organ wasn't being used.
Do fellow board members think that a retainer should be paid when the organ isn't used at a wedding, and do they think that it's reasonable to be paid a video fee if the wedding is videoed, even if one isn't playing oneself? I'd be interested in hearing others' views.
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One could argue that by using the word 'concert' to describe an organ recital, the promoter or performer is demonstrating that s/he considers the organ to be an 'orchestra in a box'.
I must confess to preferring the term 'concert'. I think the words 'organ' and 'recital' in one sentence can summon up the picture of a dusty old organist playing obscure, atonal music in the punters' minds.
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I dont think it is a trick you have missed, I think it can only be an error on Colin's part? Perhaps, he clicks on reply and then post, and then writes a reply, then posts that?? Mind you, it's a good way to increase the postings totals on a given subject!
LOL! I was thinking the same....
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Until the recent interregnum our incumbent would say a prayer 5 minutes before the service was due to begin and would then announce "As is our custom, we shall now remain silent before the service starts and prepare ourselves for worship". I would then play the first voluntary - timed carefully - and the service would begin after the voluntary finished.
Unfortunately, this hasn't happened since the interregnum, and I've had to get used to doing battle with chatter again. It was even worse yesterday when, halfway through the opening voluntary, the churchwarden decided to announce over the sound system that the Bishop has advised people not to shake hands at the Peace, nor to practise intinction for the same reason.
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I appreciate where you're coming from, John, but, in this case, most of the electronic ranks are replacements for ranks which used to be in the instrument until it was 'classicalised' and pipes removed. Although space could probably be found again for pipes with some rearrangement of the organ loft, the problem of finance is a significant one.
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What solo stops need to be full compass on a Solo organ? Just wondering. There is a matter of cost, really. The French were seemingly being sensible in only having what was necessary. Also it took up far less room. At Tenor C on an open 8ft, remember, you have only a 4ft pipe. Think how much smaller an expression box could be too to accommodate such ranks! Less cost again.
I don't like the idea of limiting the compass of solo stops merely on grounds of cost, even if they're not frequently used throughout their entire compass.
Pity that you disposed of your copy of the Cocker....
Not only is it a good crowd pleaser, but I've a feeling that Cocker may have required coupling the Tuba down to the pedals on the last page, and thus required it to go all the way down to bottom D! 
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The Gt Cornet on my instrument is TC which I believe is normal.
Yes, indeed, and sometimes Cornets only go down as far as Middle C. But this is due to the sound of the mutation ranks ceasing to blend at lower pitches.
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I have often wondered how many octaves are actually necessary on Solo stops - certainly even on an English Romantic instrument. Tenor C for most is still often a few notes too many I would argue. What about the top octave? Does that get used very much or at all?
Why limit their compass, though, if the pipes of Solo stops are going to be going on the soundboards along with the other full compass ranks?
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I think you'll find that It is fully understood.
Yup, and very tiresome.
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HG, where did you get the Tango piece from, do you have a copy?
AJJ has beaten me to it!
Thanks for the Tango post HG - Fredrik Sixten's website is here and I have ordered a few pieces - nice stuff!!A
You're welcome!
He's written lots of gorgeous, inventive and worthwhile music. I hope you enjoy it, and I warmly commend his music to other organists on the forum. -
It wasn't particularly!
Spoil-sport!
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Deleted
Oh how I *hate* coming across posts like this!
Don't you just wish you'd arrived a few minutes earlier before the poster deleted what was probably a strongly-held, controversial and interesting point of view?! -
O.K. Perhaps there's something wrong with my hearing then.
Whilst I'd never suggest that they could replace a decent pipe organ, they have their uses for home use. Perhaps you've just never heard a decent one through a decent pair of headphones?
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Why put up with a nasty electronic thing?
Because they're not all nasty - especially not for practising at home!
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Tango on Psalm 103 - Fredrik Sixten. A lovely little gem!
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What a contrast between this behaviour and the grace that that you have shown.
Hear, hear!
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Thank you too, Will. Obtaining quotations has now begun in earnest.
He's written lots of gorgeous, inventive and worthwhile music. I hope you enjoy it, and I warmly commend his music to other organists on the forum.
Classic FM Hall of Fame
in The Organ
Posted
Yes, it's certainly a crowd-pleaser and one, I find, requested by my 'punters' as much as THE Widor and BWV 565 (sorry, Vox!
). And, I must confess, I can enjoy it on the odd occasion when I choose to 'let my hair down'. Does not even the most picky gourmet occasionally have the desire for a MacDonalds or a bacon butty with cheap white bread and lashings of tomato sauce? *drools*