GrossGeigen
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Posts posted by GrossGeigen
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This from the "Music and Musicians Diary" in the Yorkshire Post, published sometime during 1987 but the exact date is missing. Entitled "Stop and go....."
"A piece of Bradford's musical heritage could soon be heading Down Under if negotiations for its purchase are successful.
The chance to buy a cathedral organ is a rare occurrence but the opportunity arises this month and a potential Australian buyer has already emerged.
Work on re-ordering the interior of Bradford Cathedral which involves removing the pews and creating a meeting area at the rear of the Nave is scheduled to begin next month. However, the centre of the planned open space is at present occupied by a 34ft. tall Nave organ, an insensitive example of 1960's ecclesiastical kitsch, designed by Sir Edward Maufe.
The free-standing Hill Norman & Beard instrument of 13 stops is played from the console of the main organ some 60 or so feet away and was installed to reinforce congregational singing.
The only solution was an organ transplant. The instrument, whose purchaser must supply his own console, is therefore on the market for between £8,000 and £10,000. Talks have already taken place with one American and negotiations with a school in Australia are proceeding. In the meantime the organ is to be dismantled and crated.
Some form of computerised amplification of the main organ is envisaged to replace the present division. The Cathedral's administrator says: "The Nave organ is hideous and it was in the way of the re-ordering scheme. There were no objections to our selling it." "
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Look at the Hill spec of 1904. Flue doubles on Great and Swell - how it was deemed musically advantageous to have these removed is a mystery, yet it happened elsewhere. Whatever is now on the Swell Bourdon slide (even if it is not the added Mixture God forbid) might be awkward enough to tune - reaching down between various 8ft basses in the vicinity.
Somewhere I have press cuttings from the time of the removal of the Nave organ - it was quite well covered in the Yorkshire Post at the time. It was suggested that the organ had found a home in Australia.
As one of the fore-runner nave divisions in any British Cathedral I believe it fulfilled its musical role very effectively.
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Does the H&H console (no doubt nicely made) remain in situ or has the Bradford console gone in its place?
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My worst delay occurred in May with an unprecedented 1 hour, 15 minutes. Like you, I had no further engagements later in the day but a string quartet (poor souls - who DID have somewhere else to go) were engaged to play up until the bridal entry when the organ was required.
The reason - "make-up issues"....I'm not joking.
I agree with all you say.
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I believe much of the Solo is being retained, as well as a significant amount of the Pedal.
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I remember visiting Down Cathedral in the late 1990's and being told that the pipework for the Pedal Trumpet, added by H&H in their 1966 rebuild, had been originally manufactured for the RFH project but ultimately had not found a home there. It is certainly an effective stop in an instrument which I recall being very enjoyable (and comfortable) to play generally.
Incidentally, this Pedal Trumpet is set away from the main case to the right of the console (and possibly behind the player) in its own neatly panelled enclosure.
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Yes, there was a separate set of switches for the Pedal to Swell Pistons. AJJ will no doubt recall the very orderly cupboard at the bass end of the console and attached to the casework (with framed glass doors) and multitude of switches.
As a brief digression (apologies for which!) : I don't know if I'm alone in thinking it a pity that the otherwise well-preserved 1898 Lincoln console (very advanced, gadget-wise, for the time) languishes somewhere up in the Choir triforium. I believe St. Patrick's Dublin has a similarly abandoned 1902 console (possibly with the "Hoc organum.." nameplate whipped off) but otherwise in a good state of preservation.
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Has anybody heard which firm has been contracted to carry out the restoration?
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Any idea who is lined up to undertake this work?
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Lewis & Co. experimented with a form of extension just before WWI, but in only two instruments that I know of. In both instances, the same "expert" was involved. One of these churches had, incidentally, received a quotation from Hope-Jones some years before.
I couldn't be certain that these, by any means, were the earliest examples though!
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Having had the pleasure of playing the "former" Mirfield H&H about three years ago, I can testify to the beauty and effectiveness of this instrument, despite it being originally designed as a residence organ, and with the advantage of a benevolent acoustic. I use the term "former" as it was replaced last year by a much larger 1989 H&H, itself a former residence organ, but without the same generous provision of 8ft flues already mentioned.
On Youtube you can hear this "former" organ by typing in "Holy Week at Mirfield 2008" in the search box. You'll hear a very forthright and compelling Oboe stop.....
This memorable little instrument was carefully dismantled by the original builders, and is safely stored.
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Likewise, I hope all goes well with the Ripon project - I recall some happy memories of a couple of Carlo Curley concerts there in the 1980's - his own pleasure in the instrument was communicated effortlessly to the hundreds gathered in the nave.
Being unashamedly self-indulgent here, and sadly never having had the privilege of trying the instrument, I've often speculated as to how useful a free-toned Trumpet might be on the Great, voiced on the flue pressure? I certainly wouldn't question the rationale for the proposed Harmonic Flute.
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Yes, I had seen the Auckland ones - I agree with you regarding the aesthetic qualities. I suspect this is a revival of an old tradition, although I suspect Willis was one of the last firms to stop using them the first time round with the likes of Dunedin Cathedral, Westminster Cathedral gallery console etc..
It's sad to contemplate the many such sets of keys (often paired with jointless ivory natural keys) which will have been needlessly dumped in the course of "essential" modernisation over the years.
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I've also seen them on a late Lewis & Co job, c.1910.
As far as I know, these sharps were originally developed by the piano manufacturer Collards, and I've heard them refered to as "Collard sharps". I recall reading an interview with old man Willis in an edition of "Scottish Musical Monthly" from c.1895, in which he mentions having "an arrangement" with Collards for manufacturing these keys in the Rotunda. I have a feeling that there are instances of the Willis firm using them in a few consoles after the WWI, but there are others who will know.
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Regarding the Bruges organ, have a look on the NPOR at A00002 (Sandy Baptist Church) - the organ has an interesting provenance, prior to subsequent "attentions" of various West Yorkshire firms. I understand that this instrument was on the point of becoming yet another contract for a skip hire company, when a former Conacher employee (who had known the organ in its Barnsley days) managed to kick-start the rescue process which has now come to fruition.
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Former St. Paul's Cathedral (pre 1977).....?
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There was certainly an organbuilder by the name of Marshall Sykes, based at "Bramstan Organ Works" (!) in Stanningley. An ex Binns, Fitton & Haley man, he was active from the mid-1950's (perhaps after B,F&H's demise c.1954) and through the 1960's. The majority of his work would appear to have been carrying out electrifications.
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I have a copy, somewhere, of his "York Minster" from the Three Cathedral Voluntaries - outrageous....
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A worthwhile line of enquiry may also be the Scottish Cinema Organ Trust.
www.scottishcinemaorgantrust.org.uk
Good luck.
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I'm not sure about attitude. It may well be ability (or lack of it)!
The Engineers certainly had the measure of the Lincoln instrument when they recorded Robert Gower there about 1987 - anyone remember "Music for Organ" which went out every Monday evening on R3, about 6.30pm ?? Programme: Pageantry (Campbell), Rhapsody on an Old English Folk Tune (Rootham), Three Pieces (Marshall). This was a consumate demonstration of the instrument (probably recorded from the head of the Nave) and without the assistance of general pistons.
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A couple of Elvinisms:
"A dazzling stream of silver" for Harrison's new choir Mixture at Lincoln in 1960.
"Golden-toned Trumpets" for the Great Trombas at Ripon.
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My limited understanding of these matters is that charge or exhaust refers only to what mechanism sets the wheels in motion. The final stage of pulling down the pallet is inevitably done by a large motor collapsing and drawing a pulldown wire with it, and in the course of electrification that can be caused to happen in a number of ways by where you place the magnets and what design of magnet is chosen.
Please don't!
My guess would be that only the first 30 (or 32) notes of the Great Double are on an independent chest, above which they sit on the soundboard. Therefore, you're not going to be able to borrow or extend to the pedal without making (and locating) a standalone unit chest for this rank. Therefore, you may as well provide an independent rank and not take up valuable floor space with something which is not going to add anything (because it's already doubled by the manuals).
The very instant you change anything. Restoration means putting back.
I'm glad there has been no mention of digital pedal stops. I know some here like them, but they never seem to last long.
Hill actions of this vintage tend to be charge "all the way", from the touch-box at the console (driven by sticker off the key) via one or two sets of diaphragms, inflating a large, externally-mounted, pull-down motor.
I've never found these actions anything but robust and reliable, allowing for the inevitable deterioration in leatherwork of course. As with any design of pneumatic transmission, it doesn't appreciate being cooked during the winter months, although it would certainly appear that the Shrewsbury mechanisms have had to endure pretty severe extremes of atmospheric influence!
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I suggest this has nothing to do with Norman and Beard and everything to do with the firm who electrified it, what transmission system they chose, whether or not the final stage was releathered, and if so in what thickness material.
The few Hill (pneumatic) jobs known to me from this period have their entire underactions (one or two sets of diaphragms and main pull-down motor) set up externally to the soundboards (possibly Ilkley would have been this way in 1901, MM). If Shrewsbury is similarly designed, it would be interesting to know what proposals have been made regarding electric conversion (and the extent to which any existing pneumatics, appropriately restored, would be retained) in view of the reportedly extreme vulnerability to "climatic derangement" (and lack of accessibility) of this instruments mechanism at present.
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I don't want to end up caught in one of my characteristic circular arguments, but I really don't see how this can be possible. Restoration is about doing the least amount of work necessary to render an instrument in as-new condition. Consumables are; sheepskin on reservoirs and pallets, leather buttons and felt washers. In short, getting to grips with the fundamentals before worrying about anything clever.
The other approach - adding stuff on clamps, electrifying pneumatic pedals, adding pistons, swapping Dulcianas for Mixtures - all requires things to be bought or made and the organ adapted to take them. That is inevitably an expensive process.
Any perceived added value assumed by the term 'historic' needs to be carefully accounted for - for instance, have pipes been lengthened in a return to cone tuning, or has an original swell mechanism been replicated? None of these is likely to cost any more than the alteration did in the first place.
In my view, the basics have to be right before any discussion of whether or not a change of direction is appropriate; it's usually straightforward to apprehend quite quickly what has gone on inside an instrument, and work out whether it was done for any reasons other than convenience, incompetence or ego. Some changes (eg slider seals) can actually be important or even vital to the survival of an instrument, and quite easily reversible.
In connection with a couple of matters here - just last year, a substantial two-manual Willis of 1892, pneumaticised in the mid 1920's has been "restored" with substantial lottery assistance. Mechanical key action has been re-introduced. The original Great Dulciana has given way to a new quint (1892 Willis?) Mixture, and a Trombone (never envisaged in the original scheme) has been added to the Pedal. The stop action is solenoid-driven, controlled by state-of-art piston gadgetry and the swell pedal is balanced. Clearly not an "historic" approach, but one which the decision-makers within the lottery fund must be comfortable with.
News from Bradford Cathedral
in General discussion
Posted
The above item prompted a few letters, and from this Bradfordian...
"...The planned re-ordering certainly exhibits the whims of the Cathedral authorities. Twenty five years ago they were determined to have this instrument. Now they are equally keen to have it out. In AD 2012, Bradfordians may well ask "What on earth made them remove that perfectly good Nave organ, which belonged where it was?" "