pcnd5584

I also considered this, but I think that the chorus reeds are better than Skinner's. HWIII was particularly disparaging of Skinner's Diapason chorus work - and his chorus reeds.

I am not sure - but there are some pointers. 1) The building is not particularly resonant 2) The reeds sound English; the Pedal reeds are loud and fat enough to be Willis or Harrison reeds, although the clavier reeds sound more like Willis reeds (particularly the quieter Trumpet stop used for the middle section). However, they could also be Harrison reeds which have been revoiced. 3) The weight of the Pedal flues again suggests a large Romantic English organ. 4) The Pedal 32ft. reed is quite fundamental, with little harmonic development and probably high pressure, or leathered shallots, perhaps. However, it is not enormous. such as that at King's, or the two louder 32ft. reeds at either Durham or Redcliffe. In any case, the acoustic is completely wrong for Durham. However, the big G.O. reeds do not sound like the Trombe at Redcliffe. 5) The organist is good, playing at a quite brisk pace and with no obvious mistakes. 6) The clavier flue-work has a certain weight, but no real brightness, so it still sounds like a Romantic English organ. perhaps by Willis. Colin Walsh recorded this piece at Salisbury; however, I know this instrument fairly well - and this recording sounds nothing like it. This is where you post a reply, informing me that it was played by a blind one-armed twelve-year-old Portuguese girl, on the two-clavier neo-Classical electronic organ in the Church of Our Lady of the Immaculate Toenails, Rochester, NY, USA....

Thank you for this. However, this raises a further question, since the Pedal Trumpet at Down Cathedral is at 16ft. pitch - yet there was no chorus reed stop of this pitch specified for the RFH Solo Organ. The 8ft. Clarinet later became a Corno di Bassetto (at 8ft. pitch), then was Anglicised to a Basset Horn (again at 8ft. pitch) and finally a Basset Horn at 16ft. pitch. In which case, I wonder which rank this stop was intended to be at the RFH. Perhaps it was originally for the Tuba Major and was increased in scale and given a new 16ft. bass octave.

I knew that the decision to alter the tonal scheme of the Solo Organ in the RFH was taken virtually at the last minute. (Downes states that this division was the only one for which the soundboards had not already been constructed.) However, I had not realised that they had gone as far as manufacturing some of the pipe-work. The Viole Céleste (or at least one rank of Viole pipes - originally intended for this instrument) has, since 1993, been situated in the Solo expression box of the instrument in York Minster. Does anyone know of the existence (and current location) of any other ranks of pipes, formerly intended for the 'original' Solo Organ at the RFH? * * For the sake of interest, I give the stop-list of the Solo Organ as laid out in the 'Proposed specification' (of early 1948): SOLO ORGAN Flûte Conique 16 Major Principal 8 Flûte Majeure 8 Viole de Gambe 8 Violes Célestes 8 Quint 5 1/3 Grosse Octave 4 Harmonic Flute 4 Grosse Tierce 3 1/5 Septième 2 2/7 Blockflute 2 Grand Cornet III-V Orchestral Bassoon 16 Orchestral Hautboy 8 Clarinet 8 Tuba Major 8 (Higher Pressure) Tuba Clarion (Higher Pressure) Aside from an untidy mixture of languages and an inconsistency in the application of the prefix 'Grosse', I regard this as a good scheme - certainly far more interesting (and useful) than that which was eventually provided. Not only would I agree with Cecil Clutton that 'five complete manual choruses seems somewhat wasteful in a concert instrument', but I would further suggest that thoughtful design and voicing of the other four choruses would have obviated the perceived need for yet another chorus. Whilst it could be argued that this would have entailed a compromise in Downes' vision for the instrument as a whole - and thus relegated it to being eclectic, the inescapable corollary is surely that, as it stands, it is surely eclectic in its aural personality. There are French reeds (of whatever quality) sitting atop flue-work which draws its inspiration from both the North German and the Dutch schools. There is also a little of England here, too. In addition, there is a flavour of North America here, too - or at least, G. Donald Harrison's tonal ideals - in the large Swell Organ, with its separate mutations, high-pitched mixtures and quasi-French reeds.* It is interesting to note that Downes had specified both a Grosse Tierce (3 1/5ft.) and a Septième (2 2/7ft.) - which should properly have the prefix 'Grosse' applied to it also. However, as built, the RFH organ contained neither of these stops - a surprising omission. In fact, looking at the original 'Proposed specification', I cannot but wish that this had been the one which was built. On paper, it appears to me to be rather more versatile than the instrument as it now stands and, since the same builders and voicers would have been responsible, it would surely have been of the same high quality as the actual instrument. There are several features which are both interesting and forward-looking: the Pedal Organ, with its separate mutations in the 32ft. harmonic series (Tierce 6 1/5ft and Septième 4 4/7ft.), the second, enclosed 32ft. reed (Posaune). This would have been really useful. The G.O. is not vastly different to what is there now. However, perhaps one weak area was the relative size of the Positive and Swell organs. It could be said that, at nineteen stops, the Positive organ was unwieldy and that the Swell Organ (with seventeen stops) lacked certain ranks which could be considered 'indispensable'. The omission of a unison Diapason is surprising, as is the inclusion of an Octave Oboe. The Positive Organ in fact appears to be an amalgamation of most of the ranks on the present Choir and Positive organs. As a matter of interest, there are very few examples of an Octave Oboe (or Hautboy) in this country. As originally built, in 1912, the J. W. Walker organ in the Church of the Sacred Heart, Wimbledon, had an Octave Oboe in the Swell Organ; however, this rank was replaced by a Vox Humana at the time of the 2010-11 restoration by Mander Organs. Interestingly, this instrument also possessed a Septième (but at 1 1/7ft. pitch), between 1935 and 1985. (As far as I know, it was then that the 1935 additions to the Choir Organ were removed.) As an aside, I regard the removal of these ranks - which included an unenclosed Open Diapason 8ft. and a Gemshorn 4ft. - as a matter for regret. Previously, if one wished to have the original sound of the instrument, one could simply choose not to use the additional stops. Now, the player has no option. I think that I would miss the Open Diapason and Gemshorn more than the mutations. The Choir Organ as it now stands is merely a collection of quiet voices - beautiful, no doubt, but without the tonal 'structure' which a Diapason and the additional 4ft. stop would have provided. A further thought is that, since the 1935 mutations were almost certainly scaled and voiced rather differently to that which is customary today, and since a Septième on an English organ at any pitch is as rare as hens' teeth, it would have been an interesting historical record to have kept the stops. As it is, the aesthetic appeal of the console is somewhat debased by the wooden caps over the old stop-holes, which spoil the lines of the stops on the jambs. It would be interesting to know if the church retained and stored the pipe-work, in case a later generation desired to reverse the changes. * For that time. There are of course a number of builders who have followed this basic design for the Swell division in their larger instruments (Tickell is one). However, at the time of its inception, the Swell Organ at the RFH owed at least as much to the influence (as perceived by Downes) of the tonal ideals of G. Donald Harrison as it did to any other school of thought. The use of the word 'perceived' is deliberate, for it is clear from the letters which Harrison wrote to HWIII that he felt that Downes had taken his own path with respect to the specification, design and voicing of the RFH instrument.

I wonder if other board members have been watching the documentary mini-series on York Minster on Friday evenings? If so, I wonder if anyone knows why at least four of the stop-heads on the Nave console appear to have blank paper labels stuck over the engraving. Two of them are high up on the jamb, just below the four chorus reeds. Prior to the 1993 additions and alterations by Geoffrey Coffin, the G.O. had twenty-two stops; there are now a total of twenty-four stops on this division. Since the stop-heads on the screen console have clearly been skimmed and re-engraved*; I had presumed that the Nave console stop-heads would have been skimmed and re-engraved at the same time. I wonder if perhaps there have been some more recent alterations to the G.O. of this instrument - does anyone have any further information, please? * As this photograph shows: http://www.yorkminster.org/worship-and-choir/choir-and-music/organ-amp-organists.html

Ha! (Although I should still rate the Conacher at Saint Mary's Church. Calne, Wiltshire, as infinitely more deserving of the scrap-heap.)* Vox, I often learn much from your posts - something for which I am grateful. And, no , I do not wish to borrow money, or anything else.... * Yes, I have played it - on a number of occasions, including a school carol service, with a capacity audience. As far as I am concerned, this instrument has virtually no redeeming tonal features whatsoever. It was also somewhat unwieldy, due in part to a lugubrious, minimal combination system and a number of faults.

As was I - although the French do not seem to bother about this, these days. There are plenty of shop signs around Paris (for example), which employs accents on uppercase characters; c.f. firstrees' photograph - street signs too - and this appears to be an old one.

Indeed. The occasional controversial (or even outrageous) statement can do much to stimulate debate. With regard to your comment above - I should say that there are several contributors here with a far greater depth of knowledge than my own.. Vox is one. He has a vast knowledge of musical history, performance practice - and the tonal attractions of the many instruments by Hele & Co., which may be found throughout the West Country....

Personally, nothing. For the simple reason that I do not believe that under the present regime any change will be made. And, no, I do not consider myself a pessimist - rather a pragmatist.

.... Which is not necessarily proof of anything, as a trip to Dublin will illustrate. On the floor of the North Transept stands HWII's original console (1902) - complete with a Pedal Stop engraved 'Contra Posanne 32'.* I take Firsttree's point - but as far as I understood it, if the object is plural, the 'de' should be also. Research ito-date is inconclusive, so perhaps both are permissible. However, I can think of several examples of mis-spelled or mis-aligned drawstops on some quite large instruments. (The HWIII console at Salisbury Cathedral - which I last played on Monday of this week - has a number of stops with incorrectly aligned or centered engraving - which I find irritating. Still, at least HWIII did include the correct accents on French stop names.) * If one has neither the time or the inclination to visit this beautiful city, a photograph of the right-hand stop jamb of this instrument, which showed the offending stop, was used in some RSCM publicity material, certainly within the last two or three years, so there may still be a few copies knocking about somewhere. Another photograph of this console is available here: http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fcommons%2F4%2F4f%2FOrgan_St._Patrick_Cathedral_Dublin..jpg&imgrefurl=http%3A%2F%2Fcommons.wikimedia.org%2Fwiki%2FFile%3AOrgan_St._Patrick_Cathedral_Dublin..jpg&h=822&w=1098&tbnid=_j9TpKF8vaWwQM%3A&zoom=1&q=organ%20patrick%20dublin&docid=92Q4WQNF6tUnrM&ei=WFltU-_1A-HH0QXJkoGQBA&tbm=isch&ved=0CFsQMygAMAA&iact=rc&uact=3&dur=509&page=1&start=0&ndsp=43. Unfortunately, the original is not clear enough to be able to read all of the stop names. In addition, since it is a three-quarter view (and the Pedal stops are situated on the right-hand jamb), the angle also mitigates against success in this case.

Has anyone else seen this: http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/27/arts/music/once-top-musicians-organists-see-loss-of-relevance.html?smid=fb-share&_r=2 I would be interested to learn what other board members think of this article....

Um.... since we are talking (well, writing) about perceived inaccuracies of pronunciation and grammar, surely the above should read 'Cornet des Violes'.... In addition, even allowing for personal preferences, would it not be better to state that the RAH organ is a more suitable instrument for certain parts of the repertoire than is the organ in the RFH? (Or are you simply thinking that it has been quiet here of late - and that it was about time someone posted something controversial, in order to liven things up a bit....?)

Oh God. The worry of it is, that I am not entirely sure that this would not actually happen.

Wolsey - thank you for the link. However, I am experiencing some difficulty in purchasing this journal. For one thing, the postage (inland) does not show up on the total when I try to go to PayPal. In addition, I am unable apparently to select any other means of payment, since I simply get re-directed to PayPal - or the page on the link above. For that matter, I have also been unsuccessful in logging-on to my PayPal account; and, yes - I have typed both my e-mail address and my password correctly. Furthermore, every time I attempt to go to 'Checkout' (or to pay via PayPal), I note that the total items have increased to two - at no point did I select this. Has anyone else here experienced any similar problems - or have I missed something obvious? (Or is the BIOS site having temporary software problems?)

Thank you for this link, Alastair. I do like to keep abreast of developments in the organ world.

Neither am I sure why the fact that she plays in stilettos is 'too much information'. Now if the article had mentioned flying helmets and wet celery....

Well, quite; and - no, it does not have cloisters. What it does have (on the North side) is a rather nice vista across the re-modelled Paternoster Square. http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=paternoster+square&nord=1&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=WLhCU5rVCIud7QbvvoD4Dg&sqi=2&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAg&biw=1920&bih=976

This was indeed the case. I note (from further research) that in fact G. Donald Harrison had warned Downes, in personal letters, of the inadvisability of using imported stops - particularly reeds. In addition, he also cautioned him explicitly with regard to the likely effect of the instrument in the projected* acoustic ambiance of the completed hall.§ In addition, it appears that Rochesson was in fact only to be the 'middle-man' of the contract. In reality, he purchased his pipe-work (already voiced) from Masure Frères, of Paris. They, in turn were supplied tongues and shallots by Bertounèche (of Héry, Yonne). Furthermore, Rochesson then offered his voicing skills† at a somewhat high cost. Apparently, in the words of Henry Willis III: 'At the beginning of January [1949], the L.C.C. [as it then was] sent around to certain selected firms a list of 78 stops with Rochesson's (high) prices. This was taken as a clear suggestion that the 78 (out of 100) should be obtained from Rochesson. The matter was reported to the Federation of Master Organ Builders, who sent a letter signed jointly by the National Union of Musical Instrument Makers - the Trade Union - protesting against the suggested importation of stops from France that could be produced at least as well, if not better, in this country to the detriment of the skill and labour of our men.'‡ In the event, it later transpired that the intention was for Rochesson to supply twenty-one speaking stops (which were indicated in blue pencil on the first provisional specification). * This was initially stated as '2.2 seconds when empty.' § pp. 276-7 (reeds) and pp. 326-7 (acoustics), The American Classic Organ: a History in Letters. Charles Callahan. The Organ Historical Society, Richmond, Va. (1990). † Exactly how good a voicer he was is open to debate. There is some documentary evidence to suggest that his work was not, by any means, of first-rate quality. ‡ pp. 282-3; Ibidem.

Firstly: Gah. You are correct. I shall ask Tony to add this. Secondly: Oh. I often drink alone in the evening. Now I am worried. (Generally only wine, though. Does this make it more acceptable?)

Ha!

No, this is quite genuine. I have also seen a photograph of it. There are a number of similar 'gadgets' around. The late George Sixsmith [& Son.] also added a 'Tibia Liquida' stop to the organ of Saint Paul's, Newcastle-under-Lyme, which activates a door giving access to to a small cocktail cabinet or, if you will, a mini-mini-bar. I also had a stop labelled 'Choir to Pub' installed on the instrument at Saint Aldhelm's, Branksome, when we had it rebuilt and enlarged nearly twenty years ago. I shall probably have a duplicate made, if we ever get our organ restored and rebuilt. However, I am definitely having a further stop installed. And this one is to bear the legend 'PULPIT TRAPDOOR'. And it is going to be connected.

In which case, I look forward to hearing it live. Can anyone tell me when the next solo recital is, please? Or when the lunch-time recitals commence; the on-line website is less than helpful in its layout and search facility. For the record, whilst I cannot speak of the balance, the sound quality when listening through the system which I described is anything but emasculated. I look forward to hearing the organ once again in the 'flesh' - and assessing the improvement in the acoustic ambiance as soon as is possible.

Ha!

Ah - but do you still have an anorak?

Goodness - the place appears to have been partly ripped apart. Thank you for the link, though.