pcnd5584
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Posts posted by pcnd5584
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I notice (from the current issue of the Church Times) that a Director of Music and Organist is required for Saint John the Baptist, Peterborough. I further note (from the NPOR*) that this church possesses a 'vintage' Harrison organ, with its original stop-list largely intact. The only ranks missing are the Pedal Ophicleide, and the G.O. Harmonics (17-19-flat 21-22) and Octave Tromba. One minor alteration was the transposition of the former 8ft. Viole d'Orchestre on the Choir Organ to 4ft. pitch. There are a few colour photographs, two of which show the console, which looks to be quite dignified and largely unspoiled. However, I see that there is a note reading 'Specification superseded' near the top of the entry, so perhaps there have been some further alterations to this instrument.
It would be interesting to know whether any contributor has played this instrument and can give an idea of its current state (and stop-list).
*Incidentally, the entry as it stands is slightly incorrect: this instrument possesses (or did in 1980) three claviers and thirty-six stops, including the Swell Tremulant and the prepared-for ranks.
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Completely in agreement with Malcolm.
VA
As am I.
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Perhaps we could consider the postings with regard to Saint Woolos' Cathedral at an end now.
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... * One rumour doing the rounds is that Downes disowned the Buckfast organ in his autobiography. Is this correct?
No - although he does admit that, largely due to the excellent acoustic properties of the abbey, the instrument 'came off' much better than it should have done.
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... Although I haven't played that many major instruments in the UK (having spent a great deal of my life abroad), I could cite Buckfast Abbey as an example of an organ I have played where this is the case, which has a vast variety of softer tonal colours. I was unable to explore them all within the time available, but found it more satisfying than blasting away on the full organ for the entire visit (although the tutti at Buckfast is pretty thrilling). ...
VA.
This is (or was) indeed a beautiful instrument. The Echo Organ in particular, contained some enthralling stops of ethereal beauty. The excellent acoustic ambiance of this glorious building also added to the effect. It seems tragic that this instrument is now apparently dismantled and may not be re-instated.
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Of course you did. It's a shame you didn't let the forum know this back then (and the cathedral congregation!).
Why should I? There is no automatic right for anyone outside that cathedral staff and congregation to know this. As it happens, I was told of this by my colleague, who was informed of the fact by a member of the cathedral staff. Since, in any case, this made it third-hand information, I had no intention of passing on what might have turned out to be nothing more than inaccurate gossip.
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...Might I ask him, as one whose judgement I am coming to respect, what he thinks about this "awkward bit" musically? Although I can play the thing tolerably well in terms of getting the notes right, I've never wanted to perform it as I find the effect of continuous thick chords on Tuba alone most unpleasant. ...
CEP
It does not have to be played on a Tuba - a reed chorus, perhaps on an open soundboard would be equally (if not more) effective. Played on the G.O. reeds at Salisbury, it would sound quite impressive, for example.
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Once again, I an glad to see that you have taken my advice and are now following the good practice of most Cathedrals an Churches in hosting visiting organists outside of public visiting hours. I am sure those.who are permitted to play your organ will be pleased, and I will contact you by PM to make arrangements for my own visit.
Without wishing to prolong this absurd tangent, as it happens, I have not 'taken your advice'. I have already done this on several previous occasions, for a number of other organists - all of whom were most grateful for the opportunity. I have received your PM and, notwithstanding your attitude, I shall look at the Minster diary next Monday, and see if it is free one evening next week; at which point I will contact you by PM.
For the record, I know of a number of cathedrals at which it is either extremely difficult or simply not permitted for anyone other than the resident musicians or recitalists to gain access to the cathedral organ once the building is closed.
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She won't thank me for mentioning this (though I don't think she looks in here any more), but I am reminded of the time when Churchmouse's husband came to entertain us all on the Foghorn a couple of years ago. While he was practising on the morning before the event, a noticeboard was erected in the church saying something like, "If you wish to pray, please ask the organist to stop playing." I wish I had asked Churchmouse for a copy of her photo!
I recall JB telling me of the time that a certain lady recitalist was practising in this church some years ago. Even he grumbled that she played almost entirely on the full organ, 'adding the Tuba and octave couplers for variety'. On this instrument, the noise would have been overwhelming. Nice quiet stops on the Swell and Solo , though.
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I tried typing the first sentence into Google and came up with the announcement quoted by Blackadder on a page entitled "Newport Cathedral Choir Homepage 01/14", so I wonder whether this news isn't six months old already. A link at the bottom of the page entitled "updated 26 July 2014" takes you, predictably, to some choir updates.
Indeed - I had also heard of his departure some months ago.
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Isn't it actually a grip on reality that is lacking?
Absolutely.
Unfortunately, since Blackadder appears to have, as SL states, an over-inflated view of his own self importance, I shall not bother to dignify his last condescending post with a response.
It occurs to me that, in addition to organists either demanding or expecting to be able to indulge themselves in large quantities of organ tone, there may well be others in the building who may wish to pray quietly, meditate or simply soak up the atmosphere of the building, in relative peace and quiet.
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I don't remember being placed under any such restrictions when I last accompanied a service at Wells, but it was in the distant past ( around twenty five years ago I would guess ) and times change! I certainly was able to use all of the instrument and prepare registrations accordingly, including the closing voluntary ( which may have been the Mulet Carillion - Sortie, although my memory could be wrong about that ). In my defence my preparation was done quite early in the day and the cathedral wasn't busy, although on the other hand I'd hate to consider the possibility that the situation you found yourself in was the result of my visit!
Well, possibly - however, the situation was exactly as I described it.
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Thankyou for the invitation. I am glad to read that you have taken on board my suggestion of hosting visitors at quieter times.
Whilst the invitation was meant genuinely, you (and Colin) appear to have completely mis-read (or chosen to ignore) my earlier post.
I quote:
'Secondly, you suggest that I make the instrument available 'after hours'. Whilst I have, on occasion been happy to do this when asked, on the particular occasion of the American gentleman's visit, as stated, I was unable to be there. I can hardly expect a colleague to make a special trip (of nearly thirty miles), in order to let in a visiting organist who simply wants to play the organ, then wait there for an hour or so, in order to let him out. (The stipulations of our insurance company would preclude the loaning of a key to the building, to a non-staff member.)
In addition, you seem to imply that I should like nothing better than to give up my free time of an evening, in order to hang around in the Minster, whilst a visitor blasts away for an hour or so on our chamade. Aside from the fact that, during school terms I work for around seventy hours a week (with no day off), I am usually working each evening - often until around 21:00 or even 22:00 - and then in school the next morning at around 07:40. Frankly, I find your attitude rather insulting.'
Blackadder, if you were doing your best to maintain this kind of work schedule, would you do what you are apparently demanding that I should do?
Colin - I did not 'fall on my own sword' - my later post was intended to mean that, despite the rudeness of this particular contributor, I would still make him welcome if he wished to play the Minster organ.
I do not regard this as falling on my own sword.
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A visiting organist would expect to play the complete organ. That isn't a demand but a reasonable expectation. ...
Again, your use of language suggests intransigence.
Were you to be the custodian of a fairly large instrument in a very busy church, in which there are a good number of people with whom you have to work side by side, on a daily basis, you might find tit necessary to moderate your viewpoint.
In any case, I have myself been quite happy to accept the stipulations of the resident staff at various cathedrals, when playing for choirs - and not just having a 'jolly' on the instrument. for example, at Chester Cathedral, last summer, I was playing for most of a week and a week-end for a visiting choir. I did all my practice on the Swell Stopped Diapason - box tightly closed - no exception, not even for a minute. Whilst this was inconvenient (and meant that I had to experiment with registration during the Psalms, for example), I was happy to do so. The result was that, at the end of our week's singing, I was thanked by both the clergy and staff, who said that it had made their jobs easier. It also meant that I received every co-operation from them with regard to assistance, information and anything else which I or the choir needed whilst we were there.
Mr. B, let me assure you that, should you ever visit Wimborne and wish to play the beautiful Walker organ in the Minster, you would be given the same courtesy which I extend to any other person requesting to play the instrument. And, if at all possible, I should arrange an evening visit, in order that you were able to experience the full range of the instrument.
I am, Sir, and remain
Your humble servant,
Baldrick
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I'm sorry that you do not understand my logic, which is that the resident organist should know that a visiting organist would certainly wish to use the chamade stop, the most exciting and forceful stop on the instrument, and therefore should have made arrangements for access to the organ at an appropriate quiet time.
Again, read my post more carefully. I stated that I was unable to be present on the day he was visiting. My colleague was away working on an opera course and if I had to ask the verger to come in specially of an evening, either I or the American organist would have had to pay him for his time.
As part of my job, from time to time, I play for visiting choirs in various cathedrals and greater churches. One such occasion was a visit to Wells Cathedral, where I was not allowed to play on anything other than the Swell flutes (box tightly closed), until the choir entered the cathedral stalls for the final rehearsal, prior to Evensong. This meant that assessing balance and selecting appropriate timbres had to be done 'on the hoof' and largely by drawing on knowledge of other Harrison instruments.(In addition, I was not permitted the use of any of the piston channels - so I had to use what was already set and hope for the best.) Personally, I think that I would find this type of thing rather less acceptable than the situation which I described at Wimborne, particularly since we were providing the cathedral with a free Evensong, of a good standard of singing. It was even harder to understand the vergers' attitudes, since they had apparently been throwing pews around the Nave for an hour or so, making a huge din.
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How sad then that at Wimborne, Milton Abbey and other places deliberately prevent visitors using certain stops on the organs thereby depriving them of a full experience of the instrument and probably the feature that makes it of interest anyway. Surely, a better plan is to make arrangements for visitors to play the complete organ outside of regular opening hours or at times when visitor numbers are low eg 9.00am. In post #56 above. I see the person at fault to be PCND himself and regard the Minster's action with the ventil stop as petty and mean.
I think that this reply says rather more about your attitude than it does mine.
Firstly, you appear to ignore the fact that I had stated that we rely on the goodwill of many helpers in order to keep the building running (and open to visitors). If we lose that good will, we lose our helpers. It would be difficult to keep the building open, run the shop and attend to the many other necessary tasks each day without them.
Secondly, you suggest that I make the instrument available 'after hours'. Whilst I have, on occasion been happy to do this when asked, on the particular occasion of the American gentleman's visit, as stated, I was unable to be there. I can hardly expect a colleague to make a special trip (of nearly thirty miles), in order to let in a visiting organist who simply wants to play the organ, then wait there for an hour or so, in order to let him out. (The stipulations of our insurance company would preclude the loaning of a key to the building, to a non-staff member.)
In addition, you seem to imply that I should like nothing better than to give up my free time of an evening, in order to hang around in the Minster, whilst a visitor blasts away for an hour or so on our chamade. Aside from the fact that, during school terms I work for around seventy hours a week (with no day off), I am usually working each evening - often until around 21:00 or even 22:00 - and then in school the next morning at around 07:40. Frankly, I find your attitude rather insulting.
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I notice that the NPOR entry for Bude Haven includes the line "Electro Mechanical action for sops and couplers". Opens a whole new window on choir-training, doesn't it?
Interesting - one of the sops once inadvertently set fire to her music during a carol service, in this church. However, I do not think that she was under electro-mechanical control at that time.
This typo could have been my fault - or the previous organist (now retired to Dorset) - it could also have been that of the late, and sadly missed, Phil Rogers. He was always prompt in uploading information to the NPOR which I sent him. He was very much interested in obtaining up-to-date details of the organ in Saint John's Church, Wimborne. Unfortunately, by the time I had managed to gain access to this Hele instrument*, Phil had died.
* It has been partly rebuilt, with minor tonal alterations, by an unknown builder. However, I had to play for a funeral there a couple of summers ago and, from the state of it, I can see why no-one has owned up to carrying out this work. I did ask a church secretary if there were any details regarding who had undertaken the recent work on the instrument, but she said that she had no idea. With this particular church, this does not surprise me - they are very much concerned with spiritual concerns (not a criticism), and less bothered over temporal matters. This said, in a church of this size, I have to wonder why it was felt necessary to have two drum-kits - particularly when one has been largely enclosed in a home-made perspex screen (and partially roofed=in). The mixing-desk, speaker stacks and the large quantity of electrical cable untidily snaking all over the place, makes this church look rather less inviting than it otherwise might be.
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I have never met David Drinkell, something which I am coming to regret because in the few months I've been a member of this forum I don't think I've ever come across anyone who has such an encyclopaedic personal knowledge of organs. And he invariably posts in such a readable and pleasant manner, regardless of whether he agrees with one or not. And a connoisseur of whiskies to boot. What a pity we've lost him to the colonies ... ...
CEP
Absolutely. David comes across as - to use a possibly 'old-fashioned' epithet - 'a true gentleman'.
If he is ever visiting the UK - particularly the south, I should very much like to meet him and ask many questions - not least regarding the H&H instrument in Saint Anne's Cathedral, Belfast.
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I remember tremendous kindness being shown to me as a young organist by people like Francis Jackson, Allan Wicks and Simon Lindley. I determined then that if I ever had the charge of a large and/or interesting instrument I would do my best to allow access to it. If the best in the business were prepared to take trouble, I felt I should do the same. Thus, with the Willis at Kirkwall, the Harrison at Belfast and the Casavant here at St. John's, the console is/was left open (an interesting object to look at, and sunlight is good for the ivories) and the vergers, guides, etc, let know that visitors are welcome to play. After all, the worst they can do is make an awful row.
I also think that it's part of one's call as organist of a church to be in contact with other organists, for mutual encouragement and learning.
I would agree - to an extent. It also depends on how busy your church is generally. Our own has many visitors each year. We rely on the goodwill of a large number of helpers and guides, in order to assist in the day-to-day running of the building.
A couple of summers ago, I received a request to play the Minster organ from an American gentleman, who had discovered the instrument from another board (on which we both post). I was happy to give permission and contacted our office and booked a time, as requested, also notifying the vergers of the visit. I had a prior engagement in London, so was unable to be present. On my return, I was met with several angry complaints regarding the 'row' that this gentleman had made (despite being asked to bear in mind that the building received many visitors and that there were several people on duty). Consequently, it was necessary for me to spend some time rebuilding bridges with my colleagues and other Minster workers. I was also surprised to read the American organist's own 'complaint' - apparently he was asked to play more quietly by one of the staff or helpers; at this he became - shall we say - disgruntled.
I cannot say that I was impressed by this turn of events. Consequently, we now 'vet' people, before allowing them the freedom of the console.
The other thing which we have done, is to have an electronic 'ventil' lock fitted, in order to isolate the Orchestral Trumpet (a chamade reed of great power and brightness). Following this afternoon's funeral, I shall remove the key to this lock - and replace it when I am next on duty.
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Kilkhampton Parish Church is well worth trying, although it may not be too close to you. One of Roger Yates's best. The Methodist Church has an intriguing Father Willis three manual chamber organ with seven speaking stops - multum in parvo. Sadly, the Nicholson/Yates at Newquay was destroyed in a fire some years ago.
Slightly closer to you is Budehaven - the Parish Church of Saint Michael and All Angels. The organist there was the organist at Kilkhampton for several years, until recently. He is a personal friend and I could put you in touch with him, if you wish.
Saint Michael's, Budehaven has a two-clavier instrument, rebuilt by Osmonds, in 1966. Lance Foy (partly at my instigation) did further restoration work in about 1989. The instrument includes a Double Trumpet - Trumpet (16ft./8ft.) unit on the Swell (which is also available on the Pedal Organ at 16ft. pitch). The G.O. is fairly complete up to a Mixture III and a fat, loud Trumpet (which should be labelled 'Tromba'). The organ is played from a detached console at floor level, which has a reasonable supply of pistons.
Kilkhampton might not be so easy to get on these days - which is partly why my colleague moved over to Saint Michael's.
Let me know (via PM) if you wish to contact the organist at Saint Michael's.
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Are there any recordings available of the Hill organ in St Mary-at-Hill, London, that was reconstructed by our hosts? As the church offers itself as a recording venue in the web, I expected to find some, but didn't.
The history of that reconstruction reads quite interesting. One wonders how the first attempt could go that far astray.
Best regards
Friedrich
The only recording of this fascinating instrument of which I am aware, is an old LP (with a monochrome photograph of the case on the front face). I have no recollection of who was playing on the recording - or what was played. None of which quite answers your question.
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I find it difficult to imagine anything less enjoyable or more boring and pointless than going on an organ crawl, especially with people who do enjoy such things. My local association doesn't do anything else. Fun? I'd rather watch paint dry!
I am with Malcolm on this one.
Around here, apparently (so a colleague informs me), organ crawls almost always consist of the same people playing the same (generally loud) pieces (generally quite badly).
I think that I should almost prefer to be stuck in a lift with a dead horse.
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pcnd - Aren't you forgetting Calne Parish Church?
David - not at all - I doubt that I could ever forget this instrument. However, the orgue de chœur at Chartres is far worse.
In fact, infinitely worse.
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Everything about the Cathedral at Chartres (with the possible exception of the orgue de choeur) is wonderful and the improvisations at Mass are usually out of this world!!. ...
Ah - so you have played this execrable 'instrument', too?
I once had to play it for a concert (including a large-scale improvised set of variations). It is, without doubt, the worst organ I have ever played. and those enclosures which house the pipes (with their propped-up lids) look like nothing so much as a row of coal bunkers.
This is probably the only organ which I have wanted to burn.
Suggestions on improving a pipe organ
in Nuts and bolts
Posted
Clearly it depends on several factors: for example, the availability of funds, the amount of floor-space (and height) which can be utilised, the usefulness and flexibility of the various ranks (particularly the extended Geigen rank), the capacity of the wind system (reservoirs or concussion units?), suitability of sound-boards for modification, console and action (is electro-pneumatic action used, or are there still electro-mechanical ladder-switches, etc?) and a host of other considerations.
David's suggestion of getting the input of a reputable consultant is certainly sound advice.
In addition, I would only make one or two suggestions, since I have not heard this instrument in its surroundings and so I am not in a position to judge either the effectiveness of the individual ranks, or that of the ensemble. However, speaking personally, I should wish for an Oboe (or Hautboy) on the Swell. What is the composition of the Swell Mixture at C1? If it begins at 15-19-22, it might be possible to discard the Flautina and insert an Oboe, providing of course that there is enough space on the slide to take the pipes. If the Flautina was original, this may well not be possible, since the slide is likely to be too narrow.
It may be worth (as David also suggests) acquiring the services of an experienced voicer. It is possible that, with careful regulation and re-balancing of the G.O. ranks, an acceptable chorus is achieved. It might also be worth having someone in the trade look over the blower. Is it functioning correctly and at capacity? In addition, checking over the entire wind system, and the sound-boards and other wind chests, particularly that of the extended rank, might reveal a problem which could be fixed at a reasonable cost.
However, if there is a clear desire for other alterations (are you the organist at this church, incidentally?), then there are a few other points which might be worth investigating. For example, the provision of a quiet flue sub-unison rank to the G.O. It is possible that making the Geigen extension available at 16ft. pitch, in addition to the other three pitches at which it appears currently, would be inadvisable. Instead, it might be possible to add a second-hand Bourdon (or even have it revoiced as a Quinatdena) to the G.O. Alternatively, if the Geigen rank is still considered to be unsatisfactory after investigation, perhaps it could be replaced from 8ft. C upwards with something more robust. (It is possible that, if this rank was originally speaking as a Salicional, it is currently being pushed past the limits of the pipe-scales.)
If the organ does sound unbalanced once the reeds are drawn, again, check the winding and chests. It is also worth checking that dirt has not got into the resonators (are they hooded or vertical?) David speaks highly of Trevor Tipple's work, so it could be that the pipes simply need cleaning and re-setting on their speech. On what pressure do these pipes speak? (For that matter, what is the pressure of the G.O. flue-work and, is the extended rank winded from the same supply?)
It is difficult to know whether the above is of any help without seeing the organ. However, I hope that there are at least some avenues for exploration which might bear useful fruit.