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john carter

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Posts posted by john carter

    Youtube

    in General discussion

    Posted

    The links to Diane Bish are very good fun - I thought this was a bit of a bizarre registration
    . But it made me think of the Allypallyorgan site http://allypallyorgan.org.uk/recordings.php the recording of Dupre playing the Widor V Allegro Vivace is scorching. Is anyone here involved with the restoration project by any chance?

    Somehow, I don't think Mander Forum readers will be reminiscing about the Diane Bish recording in 79 years time! Even considering the poor recording quality, the registration seems to follow neither the spirit nor the letter of the composer's indications. The Dupré is superb and the recording is amazing given its age.

    JC

    Herman Raphaelis Roodensteen

    in The Organ

    Posted

    Sønderborg Slotskapel

    The Chapel of Sønderborg Castle

    Mads Kjersgaard 1996

    We have a video demonstration of this instrument by our (greatly missed) contributor, Nigel Allcoat, in the "Baroque Organ Tone" thread in this forum.

    JC

    Harold Darke Plays Bach, Franck And English Music

    in General discussion

    Posted

    (Re: Franck Pièce Héroïque)

    Talking of revelations, I had never realised before, but I now know exactly where Sidney Campbell learnt this piece (he studied with Darke and Ernest Bullock). I can hear so much of SSC in this performance, even though both men very much stamped their own individuality on the piece.

    I found this a fascinating and surprising performance. Dark and sombre, evoking much more the price of heroism than its triumph; the few moments of optimism trampled by marching armies. I would love to know what was in Harold Darke's mind when he first worked on this piece.

    JC

    Help Please

    in The Organ

    Posted

    And thank you from me, Brian. I was convinced that it was by Eric Coates or Haydn Wood and I spent ages ploughing through dozens of their works, becoming increasingly frustrated at my lack of success. The ear-worm has now been satisfied and I am no longer going round the house humming the tune.

    JC

    Morning Worship Radio 4 Today

    in General discussion

    Posted

    I enjoyed much of today's (8th March) - the opening Slane was very arresting although I was not too keen on the treatment of Repton. Any other thoughts?

     

    Peter

    If that is what the congregation find helpful in their worship, I am happy for them to interpret the music in that way. But I'm sorry to say that I found no inspiration in it. While listening, I thought of the words of Prince Charles "Like a carbuncle on the face of an old friend".

    JC

    Youtube

    in General discussion

    Posted

    Also this is awful ! not really the playing, I mean the tone colors; this

    is WALTERSHAUSEN, one of the true "Bach organs" we still have.

    BWV 582 is excellent for displaying the incredible riches of the

    baroque organ:

     

    http://www.blockmrecords.org/bach/audio/mp3/BWV0582.mp3

     

    Pierre

    I wonder, Pierre, if you meant to write "awesome" rather than "awful*"? It sounds very fine to me both in the tone colours and the performance.

     

    * The word has two different, but opposite, meanings in English, but is most commonly used to mean something bad.

    JC

    At Least It Was Interesting

    in General discussion

    Posted

    I have also had a bad experience with this instrument.

     

    The planning of the divisions (with regard to the specification) is odd, for a start. There is no Swell Diapason, no separate Fifteenth on the G.O. (or a separate Twelfth), the Swell has but nine stops - and no 8ft. Oboe, nor a Clarion. The G.O. reeds consist of a Trompette and a Trompeta Real (en chamade). There is only one 4ft. clavier flute. The Pedal Organ is a little weak in foundation stops - and I believe that the lowest octave of the 32ft. flue is electronic.

     

    However, it is with the voicing (and volume) that this organ really begins to display its idiosyncrasies. There are few of what I would term good blending sounds. There are a number of fairly unpleasant ranks; amongst the worst are the Positive Nachthorn, the west end G.O. Principal 8ft. - and the transept Swell Mixture (for the sake of fairness). There is also a lack of homogeiety within the chorus work, admittedly not unusual in an instrument which has been rebuilt so many times.

     

    In addition, the west end organ can be extremely powerful - even unpleasantly so. Whilst of course one should exercise restraint and not necessarily [ever] use the full resources of this instrument (or, God forbid, both organs combined), nevertheless, I can only wonder at the purpose of the Trompeta Real - as loud as this stop is.

     

    The console is both unwieldy and impractical. It was designed to control both the west end organ and the transept organ, so there are two sets of divisional pistons, neither of which are in a useful position. The drawstops are simply daft. A dark wood was chosen for the stop heads, with off-white, red and either blue or green for some accessory controls. Naturally, it is difficult to read some of the stops at a glance. In addition, the stop jambs are hardly ergonomically designed. There are, of course, the stops for both instruments, together with a few transfers (although not as dangerous as Norwich Cathedral in this respect).

     

    Thanks, that is a helpful insight.

    JC

    At Least It Was Interesting

    in General discussion

    Posted

    Yoy can't be serious although perhaps "incredible" is the right word.

     

    I live fifteen minutes by car but rarely go which is a shame because the choir is very good. One well known recitalist I know played a recital there about ten years ago and described the instrument as his most unpleasant experience.

     

    I once went to a performance of the Durufle Requiem there parts of the accompaniment were played on the chancel organ and parts from behind the audience on the west end division which for me ruined a beautiful performance.

     

    The very worst though was a Carlo Curley battle of the organs with his touring Allen versus the Nicholson where I could not work out which I hated more.

    I have not been to Warwick for many years. Please could contributors explain what it is that makes the present organ unpleasant or incredible?

    JC

    Hotpoint 32

    in General discussion

    Posted

    I don't see it in this edition, which, whilst not the original, is nevertheless an early French one.

     

    Yes, your edition is certainly different from mine. I have just listened to two recordings I have - David Sanger uses a céleste at that point whereas Colin Walsh does not. I do not know which is correct, but having tried Céleste on its own and Flûtes 8,4 plus trem, I find either satisfactory. The fact that my edition reads Voix Celeste and tremulant makes me suspect it is an error. Confusing isn't it?

    JC

    Hotpoint 32

    in General discussion

    Posted

    Incidentally, I have no particular wish to spoil your fun, but as far as I can remember, there are only two instances of Franck specifying the use of a Céleste in his entire organ works.

     

    There is one other that I am familiar with; for the closing 30-odd bars of the Andantino in G minor, Franck indicates Voix Céleste et le tremblant.

    JC

    St Mary's Balham

    in General discussion

    Posted

    What if BIOS put one if its wretched Historic Organ Certificates on it? Do they have any sort of binding over non conformist denominations?

     

    I know the sort of scenario you describe. The organ I first played in Leeds (in a Pentecostal church, though one that was enlighted in the 1920s to have a proper two manual pipe organ in itwas taken out early 80s, to be replaced by a Hammond (quite a good Hammond, but a Hammond, nevertheless), and not even the building appears on NPOR.

    I do not believe BIOS have any binding over anybody. It is a voluntary body whose aim is to identify and raise the profile of worthy instruments. As I understand it, it is nothing like the situation of a listed building.

    JC

    Do These Games Make Any Sense?

    in The Organ

    Posted

    On snowy days and others when there is nothing better to do, list members are tempted to post a problem such as "Design an organ with m manuals, and n stops".

     

    I can imagine that on another discussion board the problem might be posed, "Select a world cup football (Soccer) team from the players in any English clubs that you choose". It is a well-defined problem, even if every single respondent has a different selection. A problem such as "Select a team for the Olympics" is not well defined if we are not told whether we need a football team or one for water polo.

     

    1) The first problem that occurs to me is that a dozen organ builders given the same paper specification, at least at the level of detail offered in the solutions on this board, might produce a dozen good organs none of which sounded like any of the others. How many open diapason 8' stops have you heard, and how varied are they?

     

    2) The second is that in most, but not all of these problems, the intended purpose of the instrument is not stated. Is it to play Stanley, Couperin, Bach, Franck or Messaien? Is it intended to play everything from the Robertsbridge Codex to the piece that I might compose next week? Is it a recital instrument, or an accompanying machine?

     

    If the conclusion is that the exercise makes sense taking into account (1), then should the conditions of (2) be imposed so that participants are playing the same game on the same pitch?

     

    We know, we know! It isn't a serious exercise, but it throws up some interesting snippets of information. Please don't let reality get in the way, we have enough of that outside the window today.

    JC :rolleyes:

    Stuck At Home In The Snow, I'm Bored - Stoplist Time, Anybody?

    in The Organ

    Posted

    All good ideas. My instinct is for the 16' stopped flute over the string but I could be converted.

     

    My immediate regret is only having the Gambe on the G.O. to accompany the Cornet or the Voix-humaine. I originally had a Bourdon 8' on the G.O. (and a different flute on the Récit) and deleted it to get down to 30 ranks; probably better to lose the Clairon. Or the Ped. Quint.

    Yes, indeed. The Bourdon 8' on the GO would be a valuable addition and the whole scheme would then be just the job for lots of lovely Franck! I think my liking for soft manual doubles comes from the experience of muddy 16' Bourdons voiced more for the pedal than the manual.

    JC

    Stuck At Home In The Snow, I'm Bored - Stoplist Time, Anybody?

    in The Organ

    Posted

    Here's something warm and French to cheer myself up:

     

    Pedal

    Contrebasse 16'

    Soubasse 16'

    Quint 10 ⅔'

    Flûte 8'

    Flûte 4'

    Bombarde 16'

    Trompette 8'

     

    Grand Orgue

    Bourdon 16'

    Montre 8'

    Flûte harmonique 8'

    Gambe 8'

    Prestant 4'

    Flûte 4'

    Piccolo 2'

    Fourniture IV 15, 19, 22, 26

    Trompette 8'

    Clairon 4'

     

    Récit

    Bourdon 8'

    Salicional 8'

    Voix céleste 8'

    Flûte conique 4'

    Octavin 2'

    Cornet III 12, 15, 17

    Basson-Hautbois 8'

    Voix-humaine 8'

    tremblant

    Usual couplers

    Mechanical action and a Sub-octave to the Récit.

     

    Sorry I couldn't fit a Cromorne in.

    I could live with that, as I could with Voix Mystique's scheme (Welcome back, by the way!), but I would miss a Trompette on the Récit. The Hautbois would need to be more of a Petit Trompette, or perhaps drop the GO Clairon. I would also have a preference for a double string, Violonbasse, rather than a Bourdon on the GO.

     

    Without wishing to go over old ground, having been brought up on a 1939 Compton (Still in good voice after 70 years with no major rebuild) I believe some intelligent extension could add a lot of value with 30 ranks.

     

    JC

    Modern Tracker Action Organs

    in Nuts and bolts

    Posted

    Grosvenor, Bridgetown, Douai, Limehouse, Giles-in-Fields, John's Oxford, St Antoine et al will feel just as taut and new-out-of-the-box in 2060 as they do now. (I wonder what will have happened to the Turner Sims by that time!) If I'm right, I'll send you a postcard.

    Q... "What would you like people say about you in fifty years time?"

    A... "Doesn't he look good for his age"...

     

    I hope the postcard will be addressed to somewhere nice and not too hot!

    JC

    Vierne : Messe Solenelle

    in The Organ

    Posted

    The final voluntary is the Allegro Maestoso from Vierne II, complete with a good blast from the Trompeta Real towards the end. The whole is well worth a listen as the sound quality is better than one might expect.

    I thought it was good apart from the blast on the Trompeta Real. Totally out of place to my ears and detracted from the climax of the last half dozen bars.

    JC

    Liebster Jesu, Bwv 731

    in The Organ

    Posted

    I couldn't understand why my pupil couldn't get the rhythm of bar 4 (of Bach's Liebster Jesu) right. Only when I looked closely did I discover that he WAS playing what it said (in NBA)! I have never heard it played like that and all the other copies I have (Novello, BG, Kevin Mayhew Funeral Album, Roger Davis's Tutor, this one http://icking-music-archive.org/scores/bac...ral_BWV731.pdf) have the version I'm used to.

     

    Has anyone changed the way they play this bar to the NBA version? I presume it is a correction of a misreading. Are there any other editions that have the NBA reading?

     

    It's bar 4, 2nd crotchet beat. NBA has: quaver tied to a demisemiquaver, followed by 4 hemidemisemiquavers and a demisemiquaver.

    BG, Novello etc. have quaver tied to 2 demisemiquavers followed by 4 hemidemisemiquavers.

     

    Stephen Barber

    I have always played it as printed in the NBA version. It seemed to lose something when I played it the way it is shown in your link.

    JC

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