andyorgan

I'm hoping not to appear too ignorant here, but can someone fill me in on who Diane Bish is? There are loads of youtube videos, and reading some of the comments posted by 'fans', she appears to have almost reached deity status in the organ world. Have I missed something, or is she of the generation before my time?

I've now heard a full version (actually Military Band version) and they have two different chords in these bars, so perhaps your explanation of 'editing error' is actually the answer. That's what I'm going to play anyway!

I thought it would be a good idea if the opening recital on this instrument contained music by those who use composers as their user name. However, a rather unpromising shortlist came up: Guilmant Palestrina Buxtehude Finzi Czerny Wagner ... and a couple of BWV numbers The list becomes more promising if you were allowed to use the surnames of real contributors who use their own name: Barber Sullivan Morley Walton Bennett (Rich Rod or the madrigal one) Riley Lane Batten Dove Scott Any thoughts?

And also for orchestra. We did a lighter evening with the school orchestra which included a medley of ABBA hits and they transcribed very well. I've also managed to find a CD with the Elgar on it for brass band. Will report on the passages in question...!

Sorry, its a bit late in the evening and I'm still a bit confused. The first time has d naturals in the melody and the chords, the second time, d flat in both the melody and the LH chords in the Martin version. Is that what Sinclair does? The bit about editing error on Hyps part did cross my mind, the only other explanation I could think of was that CH had heard/seen Elgar's original and that the mistake belong to Martin and/or Novello, certainly possible. Incidentally, a couple of recordings solo out the melody there, not play it all on the swell as Martin asks. I've tried it and I think I'll stick with it, just have to thicken the LH a little if you choose not to play the chords in the right hand.

I had forgotten this thread had ended on Elgar and the Imperial March, as I have a query. I've just bought off eBay the Herrick Organ Fireworks Vol8 which has it on. However, on the 4th page (p26 in the Elgar volume), in the4th bar he plays that bar as it appears on the third line of that page, ie with the chord of D flat major. Can anyone check if that's what the Sinclair transcription does, or indeed, if that's what the orchestral original does. I've tried to find a recording of the original, but don't fancy shelling out for a CD that is mostly stuff I already have. Contributions to clearing this up, much appreciated.

I'm a little chastened that after all this time, I hadn't noticed the very small print on the inside cover where this is mentioned, thank you for pointing it out. I'm assuming you have the same CD? You can't beat the opening of PS122 to that Woodward chant that starts the CD. The CD is titled Psalms of David Vol 1 (rec 1969), were there further volumes on LP that EMI have yet to trawl through?

A regular listen on my ipod is the first choral CD I ever bought. Its a reissue of an Kings/Willcocks Psalms LP and I don't think it can be beaten. Fresh, invigorating, lots of nuance in the presentation of the text, yet sounds entirely natural and unfussy. I also like the closeness of the recording, no swimming acoustics!

I had also understood that to be true. Do you think all concerned are aware of this?

It seems all has been resolved, see here.

There was a story doing the rounds while I was at university that a very distinguished former member of staff (and world authority on the organ music of Bach), did an all Bach recital on this but only using the Choir division.

Self explanatory really. What I'd like to know is, are there any movements (one, or more) of the two hours that work well by themselves in isolation (ie as a voluntary, or recital piece), or does one need the whole thing for effect and unity? I know one forum member here has reviewed a recording of the work, and might perhaps be able to offer advice?

Sorry, as a PS. I remembered I went to an organ recital in my youth. I can't remember who it was, or at the moment, even where, presumably somewhere in Yorkshire. Anyway, I remember the recitalist did something rather odd with a Bach Trio Sonata, involving 4' stops and playing manual parts an octave down. I know that perhaps doesn't qualify as 'radical reinterpretation', but it was a little odd.

I did once try something with the Bach Passacaglia and Fugue. I'm quite a fan of the two orchestrations (Stokowski and Respighi), both very commendable in different ways. I treid a sort of keyboard reduction of an orchestral score (albeit a score of a keyboard piece, if you get my drift). I experimented with a number of the orchestrations (the Schoenberg 'St Anne', and the Elgar C minor, to name a couple of others), but the P and F seemed to be better suited to this experimental treatment than those. The registration was fiddly, but worked, but what took some getting used to was not phrasing and articulating as I would normally. The orchestral versions are full of longer legato lines, hairpins in the dynamics and some judicious rubato in places. I'd like to think it works. There was no booing from purists, and the applause didn't seem any warmer than normal. I was pleased with the result, but I think the experiment was wasted on the audience.

On the subject of Sowerby, does anyone play, or know, the Sonatina?

Absolutely, I reiterate my support for the project and the organ, but my dismay for the any number of projects around the country that haven't attracted this level of public funding.

Whilst I agree with your comments, there are those in the other camp who will argue (and have done with me) that (1)this was all that these 'men' were capable of, and (2)what they did offer was heartfelt and sincere with an emphasis on the personal aspect worship, rather than the glorified concerts that a number of churches put on in the name of worship. It's not my cup of tea, but I know that what I prefer isn't their cup of tea either (mostly due to a lack of exposure, education or both), the fact is, at least in some places (eg large towns and cities), there is a choice and there are opportunities for churches to carve out a 'niche' market. Here in the countryside, that isn't an option without lengthy drives (and with children in tow, believe me, I've tried it, and still am trying it). One of our local vicars isn't keen on children coming to the 1662 services as he would rather they went to the 'Family' service. Personally, I'd rather they were made welcome at a service with a decent liturgy and hymns to match, but at those services, there are no creche/Sunday school activities for them to go to for part of the service.

Excellent news for London and the organ scene in general, and an instrument worthy of restoring. I went to a recital about 18 months ago when one whole manual was out of action (made the Widor symphony rather tricky). Howevere, one hates to be cynical here, but, isn't the education work that the article outlines a little short sighted? £350k for a school to do a project on dismantling and then putting together an organ? What about after that, surely there has to be some sort of legacy education work involved? (The St Giles one outlined in a previous post is a good example.) My previous involvment with the fund drew a blank before it got started as those churches with even a slightly evangelical aspect won't ask for money that results from an encouragement to gamble? Might I also naughtily suggest that if this church were not in London, such a large sum of money woud have been harder to obtain? Is anyone able to list organs that have attracted similar sums of money from HLF, whether in or out of London?

I don't think that is the same logic at all. We are of course assuming here that all the children themselves are innocent. I was shocked to discover the figures released this week for exclusions in school for sexual offences, and an unbelievable number that are under 10!! I provided some children for English Touring Opera 'Midsummer Night's Dream' a few years ago, boys and girls between 10-13. They all really enjoyed the experience, partly because they got to work on stage, and lark about off stage, with real actors and singers. Never for a moment did I question whether every member of the cast and crew had been CRB checked. Was I negligent here? We had parents helping out with supervision at mealtimes and with make up and loo stops, was I negligent in checking that they had been checked (given how much recorded abuse there is from family members that are not covered by CRB checks). I'm not against the checks, and clearly where people have a specific role, responsibility or post, of course they should be checked, but when we are talking about member of a choir who happen to there when children are being supervised by at least 2 CRB checked people, do we not think that is where it is a step too far? Do we check the people giving out tea and coffee at the ends of services? On the other hand, and I may be shot down for this, but I have no objection to carrying an ID card, as other citizens in Europe do. If it means fewer people sponging off our very generous benefits system, then I'm all for it, but that's a different topic.

Funny this should appear today, as this is what I spent this morning doing. I tried to order a cd from Zarex in the US. All went well until the last part of the order when the shipping chrages appeared and my cd disappeared from the screen. However, an email was despatched and the eminient organist/owner of the business got back to me within hours, the cd is on its way, and payment details were easily dealt with. I bought a couple of transcriptions from Thomas Heywood's website in AUstralia, all went well and they arrived quicker than a piece I bought from musicroom.com on the same day. On the other hand, I have struggled to get the Takle piece (that Herrick plays) from a Norwegian website, and its not that long ago I had to trek to a bank to get an International Money Order in Canadian dollars to get a photocopied piece of Elmore.

They're not very good at communication. I sent them an email a few months ago as I was led to believe they were UK agents for a foreign publisher, and still no reply. Even if the answer is no, I would appreciate a reply.

Yes, I agree, but we have to do that now anyway. I think it is three years, isn't it? I might add that even my wife has had to have two CRB checks, and she doesn't have a job! One because she lives in a boarding school, and one because she helps out at a local primary school with literacy hour for two hours a week, supervised by one teacher and two teaching assistants (all fully checked!).

I hadn't meant to come over as negative about the checks, merely the system. Any system which discourages or is likely to find abusers is to be welcomed, particularly as the church and musicians seem to have their fair share of bad publicity over the issue. -If it is a government requirement to have the checks, then they should be paying for it, not the organisation. It is crippling Scouts, Cubs etc, not to mention the burden on smaller churches. -A person should only be required to have one check, not by multiple employers. I have a colleague whose husband volunteers as a trustee to a charity which supports children's play areas. He has to have been checked by all eight play areas, as they are separate organisations, even though they receive funding from the same place. At £45 a shot, you can see who is raking it in here. Two of many anomalies of the system! I would be interested to know whether the RCO examiners have to be CRB checked or not. The other major exam boards (AB, Trinity/Guildhall, LCM) all do, but I can't find anywhere in the RCO literature that says the examiners are. Common sense would tell you that most (if not all) already hold a clearance from a cathdral, college or school. Davidh, you highlight a problem of offences that are not reported or prosecuted. The non reporting ones is an issue, when in the past an employer has discreetly asked an employee to leave without causing a fuss. But authorities are much tighter about cautions, non-prosecutions, and prosecutions that don't result in a conviction. The Soham case revealed that information and intelligence was known about, but not acted on as the authorities couldn't be absolutely sure of a conviction. Having had a Child Protection INSET at school recently, and a high profile local case, the police only prosecute when they are pretty certain (90% was quoted) sure they will get a conviction. From my understanding, this so called 'soft' information from cases where there is only a caution, or even an allegation, the police are allowed to disclose it to the potential employer now, whereas in the past they weren't. This leaves a rather large grey area.

Such a murky area! Have you found out why you have to fill the thing in if there are no children involved? The whole CRB things is huge money spinner for the govt and is flawed in so many ways. -I currently have four sep clearances from four different bodies. Why won't one suffice? -The police and other agencies are allowed to use 'soft' intelligence in their replies to the organisations, that is to say allegations and information that hasn't been tested in a court of law -I know of one place where all adult members of the choir were required to be CRB checked as they were singing with children. Sadly, a number refused and preferred to resign. The tip of the iceberg this!

Most of the the quote, first: '...his showmanship is reminiscent of those organists nearly a century ago who saw themslves primarily as entertainers, transcribing all manner of music fundamentally unsuited to the instrument. Like them Carpenter actually reinforces the old stereotypes about the organ as the vehicle for mechanical rather than subtle music-making. Except, his instrument is a virtual pipe organ which sounds blunt and brash. There's no denying his technique, especially the Fred Astaire like footwork he shows in the accompanying DVD in his transcription of Chopin's Revolutionary Etude. But after his barrage of fairground arrangements and remixes, not to mention a couple of cheesy original compositions, there's little consolation to be had in po-faced performances of Demessieux and Dupre, which many organists play with more musicianly flair'. Personally, I thought it a little unfair, and contained very little description of the music itself and I wasn't sure whether there was an axe to grind. Certainly I didn't think it was all that helpful before his UK dates this summer. Having seen some of the youtube videos, I think we ought to be helping to get people along to his dates, even if we feel unsure ourselves, which I don't, I'm still a fan and remain to be convinced the other way when I've seen him live. I'm not sure whether the reviewer is himself an organist. Googling the name only reveals that he is a critic for the Sunday Telegraph, or an acoustic pop guitarist, one would hope that the BBC haven't stooped to those sort of people to review organ cds!!