New Years Honours 2024

[DaveHarries]

Various appointments starting to become public knowledge. Among them is the organist Anna Lapwood who is made MBE. Congratulations to her.

Dave

[Rowland Wateridge]

Judith Weir CBE becomes a Dame, promoted to DBE for services to music.

[Hebridean]

And also Dr Christopher Kent, organist, appointed BEM, for services to music and musicology.

[Martin Cooke]

It's a tangled web, for sure. What about those superlative church musicians who have run the music and played solo roles as organists at Westminster Abbey and St George's Chapel, Windsor Castle, in the last 18 months or so - the two biggest funerals of modern time + the Coronation itself - and no recognition at all. I know, I know... it can't be 'all must have prizes'... but if the Archbishop can be advanced to the top-most rank of the Royal Victorian Order in one move and the Dean to the one just below that, surely, other people who actually played a key role on the day of the Coronation and in all the rehearsing before hand might be considered for an LVO or CVO. To add insult to injury, one or two HAVE been singled out... just not the people I would have chosen, and I guess that's the nub of it! It would be nice to think that (their) universities/conservatoires might step in to fill the gap.

[S_L]

1 hour ago, Martin Cooke said:

It would be nice to think that (their) universities/conservatoires might step in to fill the gap.

So they can go around calling themselves Dr. when, in fact, they have no evidence of study at Doctoral level!! No, Martin, it won't do!!!!

 

[Martin Cooke]

18 minutes ago, S_L said:

So they can go around calling themselves Dr. when, in fact, they have no evidence of study at Doctoral level!! No, Martin, it won't do!!!!

Yes, I do understand people who've worked hard over many years for their doctorates objecting to that, but the award of an honorary degree is a time-honoured way of marking achievement - though I appreciate that it is no less controversial than the Honours system. Not only is it a tangled web, but also a can o' worms!

[Adnosad]

Just love the pun on " played a key role "!     :))

[Barry Oakley]

It's time this feudal system was scrapped! When people in essence are recognised simply because they have vast wealth available for political parties, or it's who they know or it's the circles the move in, bears no comparison with the deserving who have given their lives to outstanding service to humanity and who go unrecognised.

[Barry Oakley]

12 hours ago, DaveHarries said:

Various appointments starting to become public knowledge. Among them is the organist Anna Lapwood who is made MBE. Congratulations to her.

Dave

What a joke!

[sbarber49]

1 hour ago, Martin Cooke said:

but if the Archbishop can be advanced to the top-most rank of the Royal Victorian Order in one move and the Dean to the one just below that, surely, other people who actually played a key role on the day of the Coronation and in all the rehearsing before hand might be considered for an LVO or CVO. 

I watched the programme "King Charles lll, the Coronation Year" which spent a very long time going through the tiniest details of the preparation for the Coronation; the Gospel Choir was featured but there was no mention at all the the cathedral musicians or Pappano. Extraordinary. 

[Adnosad]

1 hour ago, Barry Oakley said:

It's time this feudal system was scrapped! When people in essence are recognised simply because they have vast wealth available for political parties, or it's who they know or it's the circles the move in, bears no comparison with the deserving who have given their lives to outstanding service to humanity and who go unrecognised.

Agree 100/00. But so long as we have this wonderful institution we will just have to clench ourselves and bite the bullet.

[Rowland Wateridge]

The Archbishop’s forthcoming RVO knighthood was reported (or rather mis-reported by some of the ‘popular’ press) some weeks ago, and I assumed it was a KCVO, so Martin’s reference to “the top-most rank” of the RVO made me check the list and, indeed, it is the ‘top’ GCVO.  He won’t, of course, be dubbed with a sword or use the title “Sir”, so it’s ‘just’ the addition of the post-nominal GCVO.  And, to clarify, it is the Dean of Westminster who is made KCVO.   

Without wishing to add to Barry Oakley’s blood pressure, there are more than 1,200 people in the Honours List, something which strikes me as staggering logistically.  I believe some of the ‘lesser’ honours are conferred at local ceremonies by the appropriate Lord Lieutenant, but it’s still a huge number all to be bestowed individually.

Martin, I noticed that three LVOs go to ‘music advisers’ (but not the actual musicians on the day) and the military band conductor is honoured!  

But why do we agonise about this issue every year!  We all know that, with very few exceptions, the organist and/ or choir director simply doesn’t figure in the minds of much of the general public  - or the honours ‘system’, as rather confirmed by just a BEM for Dr Christopher Kent.  

Sir Antonio Pappano is promoted to CVO, and the only musician so honoured.

[OmegaConsort]

7 hours ago, Martin Cooke said:

It's a tangled web, for sure. What about those superlative church musicians who have run the music and played solo roles as organists at Westminster Abbey and St George's Chapel, Windsor Castle, in the last 18 months or so - the two biggest funerals of modern time + the Coronation itself - and no recognition at all. I know, I know... it can't be 'all must have prizes'... but if the Archbishop can be advanced to the top-most rank of the Royal Victorian Order in one move and the Dean to the one just below that, surely, other people who actually played a key role on the day of the Coronation and in all the rehearsing before hand might be considered for an LVO or CVO. To add insult to injury, one or two HAVE been singled out... just not the people I would have chosen, and I guess that's the nub of it! It would be nice to think that (their) universities/conservatoires might step in to fill the gap.

And what about John Rutter - he should surely be Sir John now given what he has given!

[michaelwilson]

James O'Donnell was made an LVO last year.

[innate]

23 minutes ago, OmegaConsort said:

And what about John Rutter - he should surely be Sir John now given what he has given!

Maybe he has turned down the offer of a knighthood. He accepted his CBE in 2007.

Honourable list of decliners here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_who_have_declined_a_British_honour

including people as diverse as Rudyard Kipling, Michael Frayn, Henry Moore, LS Lowry, Robert Morley, John Cleese, Virginia Woolf and Humphrey Lyttleton.

[John Robinson]

2 hours ago, innate said:

Maybe he has turned down the offer of a knighthood. He accepted his CBE in 2007.

Honourable list of decliners here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_who_have_declined_a_British_honour

including people as diverse as Rudyard Kipling, Michael Frayn, Henry Moore, LS Lowry, Robert Morley, John Cleese, Virginia Woolf and Humphrey Lyttleton.

A very interesting, and lengthy list.  I had to search for the name Francis Jackson, as I had heard mention that he was not in favour of such things, but no.  

It appears that he was never offered the knighthood that many have suggested might have been offered.  Obviously, he wasn't one of the 'clique'!

[Rowland Wateridge]

‘Henry Willis’ (David Wyld) has written about this more than once.  This link provides the most telling information on the subject.  This goes back some years.  You will see that David Wyld wrote to Tony Blair, no less, in 2006.  Scroll down to comment No 5:

https://mander-organs-forum.invisionzone.com/topic/1973-how-about-a-campaign/

It’s pretty clear that, for whatever reason, Francis Jackson was never offered a knighthood.

(Incidentally, petitions relating to specific honours are not accepted by the government, either for the grant of an individual honour or withdrawal of one.  This was clearly stated in response to a petition in 2022 seeking to withdraw an honour, paradoxically it was Tony Blair’s KG knighthood.  This would have failed on other grounds - a KG knighthood being in the late Queen’s sole personal gift - but the official reply was as above, without mentioning the status of his knighthood.)

[Barry Oakley]

On 29/12/2023 at 23:20, DaveHarries said:

Various appointments starting to become public knowledge. Among them is the organist Anna Lapwood who is made MBE. Congratulations to her.

Dave

And the great Jane Parker-Smith went unrecognised.

[Adnosad]

57 minutes ago, Barry Oakley said:

And the great Jane Parker-Smith went unrecognised.

Certainly not by me!    :))

[Paul Isom]

I'm slightly surprised that Andrew Nesthingha doesn't appear to have been rewarded for his work at the King's Coronation, whereas other musicians who participated were awarded honours (the conductor of the orchestra for instance).  If he has been missed out, surely this is a dreadful oversight.  Surely a worthier recipient than Ms Lapwood.....

[Adnosad]

Any chance of you possibly elaborating on your last sentence, please?

Thank You.

[P DeVile]

3 hours ago, Paul Isom said:

I'm slightly surprised that Andrew Nesthingha doesn't appear to have been rewarded for his work at the King's Coronation, whereas other musicians who participated were awarded honours (the conductor of the orchestra for instance).  If he has been missed out, surely this is a dreadful oversight.  Surely a worthier recipient than Ms Lapwood.....

Oh dear Paul, Andrew got there just before the event really and did a wonderful job with the choir but at the moment for that one occasion. Anna Lapwood has been seriously important in raising the organ/choral game to the general public. She has done more to get young people interested - particularly women.

Peter

[Martin Cooke]

3 hours ago, P DeVile said:

Anna Lapwood has been seriously important in raising the organ/choral game to the general public. She has done more to get young people interested - particularly women.

Peter

There is no doubt that AL is a very compelling force for good amongst young people and music, and I admire her musicality very much. There remains, though, the nightmare of how difficult it is to learn the organ. Quite apart from the need to develop skill on the piano first - a traditional stance, I realise, which no doubt people, these days, call into question - there is the whole business of access to a suitable instrument upon which to learn and practise. Practising in a large, dark, cold church for an hour or two a day was part of life growing up, as was the ready availability of a school chapel. But 93% of children don't attend a school with a chapel - (even assuming that ALL independent schools have chapels or organs, which they don't) - and the wholesale change in safeguarding means that children and young people simply can't be left alone to practise in church even if someone grants them permission. Chorally, things are much easier to access, from what I can tell, but the organ is still pretty inaccessible in my view. Perhaps we must just be preparered to play the long game.

[Colin Pykett]

14 hours ago, Martin Cooke said:

 ... There remains, though, the nightmare of how difficult it is to learn the organ. Quite apart from the need to develop skill on the piano first - a traditional stance, I realise, which no doubt people, these days, call into question - there is the whole business of access to a suitable instrument upon which to learn and practise ...

Surely it is here where digital organs (including virtual pipe organs) in the home have their place?  The UK domestic market for 'plug-and-play' conventional digital organs (the sort which you buy from a high street dealer) well exceeds that for churches and other venues according to estimates I have seen, currently running at a considerable number of hundreds per year.  They must be going somewhere.  Even if to older people such as retirees, many of these will be grandparents or other relatives and so younger children in their families will still have some sort of access to them if they are interested.  I don't have comparable data for VPOs, and doubt hard figures are available as many of these are put together by DIY-ers.  But it would probably be over-pessimistic to assume that youngsters in the families where they reside do not play them.  There are members of this forum, excellent musicians, who teach pupils on their own home VPO.

As to learning the piano first, the days of the acoustic piano are long past in most homes (I had to give an excellent one away to a dealer to avoid the trauma of just seeing it go to landfill), but again they have been replaced by digital ones, some of which are very good value both musically and economically.

Until we ditch the unfortunate mindset that 'the organ' equals 'the church', which still stalks this forum I am sorry to say, then I agree the problems outlined by Martin will persist, but digital technology provides the springboard to escape from it.  I suspect that this may well be happening, perhaps more widely than we realise.  It is probably more of a problem to identify exactly what a child will do with organ-playing skills today though.  Even if drawn to the church as a teenager, say, how many churches use their organs nowadays?  If the child is good enough to aspire to cathedral or equivalent status, the competition at the top for the few available posts must surely put many such youngsters off?  Even if they succeed in getting such a post, the financial problems of making a living from church music must be horrifying, except perhaps for the tiny minority who might have independent means.  I have in mind the sad story of a well known assistant organist at a top-flight cathedral who wrote down the problems, both financial and domestic, he had had over the years in trying to make ends meet.  I'm sure he is not alone.

[Martin Cooke]

14 minutes ago, Colin Pykett said:

but digital technology provides the springboard to escape from it. 

Quite right, Colin, and I wholeheartedly applaud the initiatives that Viscount have taken, working in some cases with Tom Daggett (now at Sheffield Cathedral), to get instruments into state schools. I suspect that it is a drop in the ocean so far, but haven't I seen a statement by some organisation somewhere saying that it is their ambition to get a digital instrument into every state school? Perhaps I'm making that up, but that would be a great ambition for a musical philanthropist, though the instrument still needs to be taught and pupils will still need to be able to practise on it. I'm not sure how accessible an organ in a school hall elsewhere could or would be during a busy school day.